Dark Earth Timeline Discussion

[Simon Darkshade]

November Notes
- Exercise Trelawny is both an example of a different approach to home defence and the roots of a future short story set in Cornwall
- Reverend Presley finds the lost boys
- Kaiser Wilhelm IV will be sorely missed, apart from by the Norwegian Blue, obviously
- The Glomar Explorer has a counterpart sponsored by C. Montgomery Burns
- Earlier compulsory seat belts in Britain
- Ronald Reagan wins the 1972 Election in a canter by appealing to a broad based coalition which captures the key industrial states of Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Ohio, Michigan, Indiana and Illinois and the South; the West is solid Reagan country, as in @. Humphrey wins New York (very narrowly), Delaware, DC, Minnesota, Maryland, Rhode Island, Massachusetts and Wisconsin and McCarthy wins Iowa. His cabinet is different from the @ 1980s one, with Kissinger getting a guernsey as part of the overall Republican grouping
- 1916 is a very wide sweeping war picture with many great roles
- Armistice Day is commemorated with a moment of silence in the USA as well, as a consequence of the longer American involvement in WW1
- The Environmental Protection and World Heritage Convention is a much stronger treaty making a better base for long term environmental protection
- The Cola Wars have a couple of other players, including good old Nuka Cola
- The Harrier successor will be a very effective plane whilst looking a bit less outlandish than some of the @ proposals. The Valiant comes to the end of a long and successful career
- PM Yukio Mishima is a bit more circumspect now he is in power
- Increased Soviet launches finally result in something going bang and rocket scientists getting hurty bad bad
- A black South African speaker is a different development compared to @ apartheid
- The RIAF buys French Mirages for the multirole capacity
- US production and resources are very strong
- McDonald's plans for British expansion are knocked back for the foreseeable future
- The NZ Nationals buck the trend for changes of government across the Commonwealth
- The Sognefjord incident results in a Norwegian 'Whiskey on the Rocks'
- Chrome Dome continues
- Bruce Lee recovering a long lost ancient Imperial treasure
- The Fisheries Protection Squadron usually has OPVs, but up in the Far North, some heavier ships are deployed
- The homesick musician will eventually get over his California dreamin'

[Simon Darkshade]

List of British Prime Ministers

Stanley Barton (Labour) 1964-
Sir Anthony Eden (Conservative) 1955-1964
Sir Winston Churchill (Conservative) 1948-1955
Sir Richard Harcourt (Liberal) 1945-1948
Sir Winston Churchill (Conservative) 1940-1945
Sir Neville Chamberlain (Conservative) 1937-1940
Sir Stanley Baldwin (Conservative) 1933-1937
David Lloyd George (Liberal/National Government) 1929-1933
Stanley Baldwin (Conservative) 1926-1929
David Lloyd George (Liberal) 1925-1926
Stanley Baldwin (Conservative) 1923-1925
Andrew Bonar Law (Conservative) 1921-1923
David Lloyd George (Liberal) 1916-1921
Sir Herbert Asquith (Liberal) 1906-1916
Sir Joseph Chamberlain (Conservative) 1899-1906
Lord Salisbury (Conservative) 1889-1899
William Gladstone (Liberal) 1885-1889
Benjamin Disraeli (Conservative) 1875-1885
William Gladstone (Liberal) 1868-1875
Benjamin Disraeli (Conservative) 1865-1868
Lord Palmerston (Liberal) 1855-1865
The Earl of Aberdeen (Whig) 1852-1855
Lord John Russell (Whig) 1847-1852
Sir Robert Peel (Conservative) 1839-1847
Lord Melbourne (Whig) 1834-1839
The Duke of Wellington (Tory) 1834
Earl Grey (Whig) 1831-1834
The Duke of Wellington (Tory) 1828-1831
Earl Grey (Whig) 1825-1828
George Canning (Tory) 1820-1825
The Earl of Liverpool (Tory) 1812-1820
William Pitt the Younger (Whig) 1783-1812
The Earl of Shelburne (Whig) 1782-1783
Lord North (Tory) 1770-1782
The Duke of Grafton (Whig) 1768-1770
William Pitt (Whig) 1762-1768
The Duke of Newcastle (Whig) 1754-1762
Henry Pelham (Whig) 1742-1754
Sir Robert Walpole (Whig) 1721-1742
Robert Harley 1720-1721
The Duke of Marlborough 1712-1720

Various earlier chief ministers have been described as the first Prime Minister, with some favouring Prince Rupert in the 1650s and 1660s, Sir Thomas Lacey in the 1650s but the pre 1688 system was quite different. Perhaps the earliest was Lord Blackadder during the reign of Queen Elizabeth I.

[Belushi TD]

It appears in at least two places and maybe more, that there are prime ministers who's term of office overlap with others. I don't know enough about the terms in our timeline to know off the top of my head about what they should be, so I'm asking.

Baldwin and Chamberlain both appear to have start dates of 1933. Should Chamberlain's term start at the end of Baldwin's?

Baldwin's 1923 term appears to run to 1929, overlapping David Lloyd George from 25 to 26 and then himself from 26 to 29. Am I safe in assuming that the first term should end in 25?

There's some oddities early on as well, but I assume those are due to the differences between the Dark Earth and OTL. Did Pitt the younger really run the show for almost 30 years? Dare I assume that this led to a different set of Napoleanic wars?

Belushi TD

[Simon Darkshade]

Typos fixed, for that is all they were.

Pitt the Younger historically held office from 1783 to 1801 and again from 1804 to 1806. Here, he lives for a further 6 years. begatting a son that some scallywags occasionally dub as 'Pitt the Even Younger'.

[Timbo W]

Glad to see the Sir Thomas Lacey avoided being by a sword divided

[Simon Darkshade]

I give that comment maximum points. By the Sword Divided is an excellent, excellent series full of great actors, but Timothy Bentinck holds the Cavalier side together mightily as Tom.

This isn’t the first reference to BtSD in Dark Earth, nor the last.

(Now Simon waits to see if September, October or November’s events and notes will attract any more comments…)

[Belushi TD]

(Now Simon waits to see if September, October or November’s events and notes will attract any more comments…)

They will, eventually, now that the holidays are over and things can calm down a tad.

My apologies for not being able to keep up with the flow of things.

Belushi TD

[Simon Darkshade]

That is quite alright. I’ll have December up on the morrow and a few other bits and pieces may get done over January.

[Simon Darkshade]

December
December 1: The Ministry of Space releases a report on plans for the expansion of British presence in space over the next decade and a half, with increased convoys of colonists to Venus and Vulcan authorised along with expansion of the Deimos Spaceport, several new mining expeditions to the asteroid belt and research into the construction of deep space stations at the L4 and L5 Martian Lagrangian points. Most ambitious, however, is the proposal for the development of a regular nuclear powered spaceship flight between Luna and Mars with a flight time of 80 days.
December 2: The Soviet Union announces that it will conduct a partially atmospheric nuclear test in 1973 as part of their Peaceful Nuclear Explosions for the National Economy programme, with the experimental data to be utilised for the atomic construction of the Pechora-Kama Canal, planned as employing 247 15 kiloton devices. The news is largely overshadowed by the coverage of the launch of Orion 7 from the orbit of Luna on its 5 year voyage to Orcus and Pluto.
December 3: Guatemalan backed rebels attempt to cross the border of British Honduras in force before being engaged by artillery and airstrikes from Phantoms and Buccaneers from HMS Ark Royal, whose carrier group had been deployed to the West Indies along with HMS Victoria and the Royal Marines aboard the new nuclear amphibious battleship HMS King Alfred in response to recent Guatemalan troop deployments. By the end of the day, the ready brigade of the 6th Airborne Division and two battalions of West Indian troops are airlifted to the capital city of St. George, the former by Concord, and a flight of Avro Vulcans lands at Queen Elizabeth II International Airport as a pointed indicator of British intent. The Guatemalan Army begins withdrawal on December 5th.
December 4: A visiting newspaper reporter from New York City researching a story on the Yosemite National Park prevents the kidnapping of a seven year old boy in Merced, California and places the lad’s two would-be assailants under citizen’s arrest.
December 5: The War Office announces that headquarters, support and certain combat elements of two airborne and two infantry divisions will be shifted to a special ‘ready reserve’ status from active duty from 1973, emphasising that they would continue to be considered as Regular Army formations.
December 6: The Nobel Prize dinner and award ceremony takes places in Stockholm, with the Physics prize being shared by American scientists Leon Cooper, John Bardeen and John Schrieffer for development of a microscopic theory of superconductivity, Sir John Maynard Keynes winning the Economics prize, W. H. Auden winning the Literature prize and the Nobel Peace Prize being awarded to American statesman and former Vice President Atticus Finch.
December 7: Israel and Syria move troops to their mutual border along the Golan Heights, with a number of units of the Royal Iraqi Army also deploying to Eastern Syria for joint defence exercises. Certain tensions within the Arab Union have been the cause of some disquiet in Jerusalem.
December 8: Britain and Austria-Hungary sign an arms export, defence cooperation and military equipment upgrade agreement in Vienna, with the overall value of the deal thought to be over £4800 million.
December 9: The BBC carries a segment on the ‘Average Briton’ based on data from the Royal Census and further surveys. An average British man is 32, is 6’1” tall, weighs 12 and a half stone and works 42 hours a week for 48 weeks of the year, earning an average annual salary of £2754. A new house costs £4236, a colour television £95 and a new family car will set back Mr. Average £529, whilst feeding a family of five will require him to give his wife £13 10/6, leaving him more than enough for a pint of bitter, which are 6d.
December 10: Extremely heavy snowfalls across Southern and Western Austria lead to communications and road and rail traffic being disrupted and only the dwarven Unterwegs enabling transport of vital supplies to make it through to some stricken towns.
December 11: Soviet and Chinese troops clash along their border across the Amur River in the dead of night, with small arms fire followed by an exchange between tanks, artillery and rockets before a hasty exchange between local commanders leading to an immediate ceasefire. Subsequent investigations indicate that some arcane means of confusion and simulating enemy fire had been employed against both sides to make them believe that a major attack was underway.
December 12: An SR-71 flight over the border between North and South Laos fails to show any signs of a North Vietnamese and Soviet build up, disproving speculation in Saigon to that effect.
December 13: ARPANET is projected as expanding from the current connections between the United States, Britain and Canada to include France, Germany, Sweden, Japan, Hong Kong and Australia by 1975, with further intergration of different computerised networks through the application of the 'transmission control programme' outlined by Vinton Cerf and Robert Kahn in their paper of April, which could potentially make Professor Turing's proposed 'internetwork' a working reality.
December 14: The Pope authorises release of an encyclical on certain reforms to the sacrament of extreme unction.
December 15: An end of year supplement of Janes Fighting Ships reverts from the organisational order employed since the mid 1960s whereby submarines were listed between aircraft carriers and cruisers in national ship lists to the previous traditional arrangement. The section on the Royal Navy contains details on the four planned Glorious class nuclear supercarriers intended to replace the Malta class aircraft carriers and the postulated general purpose guided missile cruisers, and concludes with a section noting that the Superb class battleships, when they leave service in the coming two years, will be the last British Empire warships that saw service in the Second World War.
December 16: Rhodesian Army troops operating along the Congolese border near Lake Tanganyika engage and destroy an insurgent force of some hundreds through extremely heavy firepower, employment of tanks and several dozen airstrikes.
December 17: Notorious Ottoman master criminal Keyser Soze is fortuitously caught by Leonard Nimoy in a hotel elevator in Alexandretta, with the quick thinking latter employing a Vulcan nerve pinch to incapacitate the rogue.
December 18: The League of Nations commissions a special scientific study on the theory of ‘global cooling’.
December 19: Supertankers MV Sea Star and Horta Barbosa collide in the Gulf of Oman, spilling over 120,000t of crude oil into the sea. The Royal Navy cruiser HMS Astraeus and the destroyers Rob Roy and Osborne move from the Persian port of Bandar Abbas to provide aid to the survivors and quell the fires.
December 20: The West Indies top world cricket Test standings after an outstanding year, ahead of South Africa, England, Australia, India, the United States, Canada, New Zealand, Rhodesia and newcomers Ceylon. Wisden also announces their ‘Cricketers of the Year’, with West Indian spin bowler Lance Gibbs and champion young batsman Viv Richards joined by Greg Chappell, Sunil Gavaskar, the Honourable Peter Ratcliffe.
December 21: Discovery of the remains of an underground city in Northern Colombia, with much of the architecture and artifacts seeming unlike anything previously found in the Americas. A carved map on the floor of one temple bears a strange resemblance to the geographical arrangement of the continents of Mars.
December 22: The current operational fleet of the Boeing Dyna-Soar is formally reclassified as the SRBL-2, reflecting its role as a spaceplane reconnaissance bomber now equipped with laser rayguns. Research and development on the adaption of current larger NASA and civilian single stage to orbit aerospaceplanes to a military role continues.
December 23: A terrible earthquake levels much of the Nicaraguan capital of Managua, killing hundreds, destroying thousands of buildings and leaving much of the populace homeless. President Kennedy authorises the immediate dispatch of USAF skyships loaded with relief supplies, medical air, food and fresh water with further American aid to come by air, sea and land along the Pan-American Superhighway, whilst the Emperor of Mexico offers his own personal craft for the provision of similar support and Britain and Moscow offer support from the Ark Royal carrier group and the battleship Lenin, currently in port in Guayaquil on a world cruise.
December 24: The 125,000t super cruiseliner SS Poseidon is hit by a freak wave on a Christmas cruise off the Canary Islands, but her exceptionally stable design and sensible provision of ballast enable her to withstand the perilous conditions that would have capsized many a smaller vessel.
December 25: Most of Europe experiences an extremely seasonable and peaceful ‘White Christmas’, with Queen Elizabeth II’s Christmas message focusing on the responsibility to help the needy, the lonely and the afflicted, at home and around the world.
December 26: Noted British philanthropist and businessman Sir Ebenezer Cratchit announces that he will be setting up a new charitable foundation to help the needy of England, named after his own family’s kindly benefactor of the 1830s.
December 27: Former First Lady of the Philippines Imelda Marcos incapacitates a burglar with an avalanche of hundreds of pairs of expensive shoes, with her collection serving her well when trouble was afoot.
December 28: The British Motor Corporation announces that it will unveil a special experimental prototype of a battery powered electrical car in the new year; previous types had been limited by the length of the car’s power cord.
December 29: An American mathematician presents a paper on whether the flapping of a butterfly's wings in Brazil could set off a tornado in Texas, leading to a heated debate encompassing free will, historical determinism and Operation Sealion; after the brawl is subdued by local police and the broken furniture and unconscious bodies cleared away, it is agreed at least that Sealion would not be realistically possible, regardless of the size of wings involved.
December 30: Panam Spaceways offers civil spaceplane package flights to Luna at markedly reduced prices of $2499.95, aiming to attract increasing numbers of middle class and business travelers for the lucrative Lunar tourism market amid the opening of Walt Disney's new family theme park in the American sector of Luna City.
December 31: An unexpected meteor shower provides a spectacular backdrop to New Year’s Eve celebrations across the Northern Hemisphere.

[jemhouston]

How long before Disney's World is built at L5?

[Simon Darkshade]

A very long time. Much easier to build on Luna itself, which has its own "thin yet breathable atmosphere and a bizarre landscape of rocks, craters, twisted plants and lichens" and small amounts of surface water, mostly frozen in the mountains and poles. The cities and other settlements are beneath their own crystal domes to allow for temperature control, more breathable air and running water, among other elements of home.

[Simon Darkshade]

British Armament Program 1972

Tanks: 3044
(125 Royalists, 254 Valiants, 96 Super Conquerors, 2569 Crusaders)

IFVs: 3500
(2750 FV-525 Warrior, 750 FV-432 Saxon)

APCs: 4522
(1548 Centaur IMV, 1174 Saladin AMC, 883 Sentinel LAV, 917 MAV)

Artillery: 2460
(82 3.75" Vickers Whirlwind SPAAGs, 138 42mm Marksman SPAAGs, 320 25mm Sharpshooter SPAAGs
290 25pdr GP Guns
100 36pdr SVAT Guns
640 L24 125mm Light Guns (300 Britain, 240 Commonwealth, 100 Scandinavia)
320 L121 6" Gun-Howitzers (160 Britain, 60 Arabs, 60 Persia, 40 Scandinavia)
240 FV236 Archbishops, 120 FV254 Lionhearts, 50 FV287 Excalibur, 12 375mm
140 Catapult MRLS)

Missiles: 268
(24 Black Arrow MRBM, 24 Blue Streak ICBM; 32 White Knight, 32 Gold Crown, 36 Black Prince, 120 Blue Water)

SAMs: 1680
(560 Broadsword, 160 Blue Envoy (240 export), 160 Bloodhound (export); 400 PT.428 Rapier SAMs, 400 EG.324 Sabre SAMs)

MANPADs: 1600
1600 Vickers Skyflash

ATGMs: 6000
1600 Hawker-Siddeley Javelins, 1200 Fairey Swingfires, 3200 Shorts Green Apples

Vehicles: 32,650
(5000 Bedford MK 5t lorry, 2500 Leyland Ranger 5t 6x6 lorry, 3000 Alvis Stalwart 10t 8x8 lorry, 150 Scammell Commander, 12,000 Land Rovers, 2000 Humber Pigs, 8000 Austin Champions)

Mortars: 2245
(957 L13 2.5", 720 L16 3.5", 240 L18 3.75" Automatic, 200 L12 4.5", 96 L35 6.5", 32 L52 10")

Small Arms
(184,532 L1A2 battle rifles, 124,749 L2A4 assault rifles, 60,187 L10 pistols, 109,263 L10A1 submachine guns, 24,555 L4 LMGs, 12,467 L6 GPMGs, 6219 L12 HMGs, 1987 Maxim Guns)

Military Aircraft: 3429

Vickers (685)
140 Vickers Thunderbolts (RAF 80, Spain 20, Greece 40)
64 Supermarine Eagle TSR-2s (32 India, 32 USA)
428 Supermarine Spitfires
64 Westland Tigers
50 Westland Sea Kings
24 Westland Westminsters

de Havilland (603)
400 de Havilland Tornadoes (240 Britain, 80 Commonwealth, 40 Benelux, 40 Germany)
50 de Havilland Vanguards (Australia)
26 de Havilland DH.125 Jet Dragons
18 Handley-Page Vengeances
24 Shorts Valentine (Chile)
25 Shorts Belfast Mark III
60 Percival Lynx

Armstrong-Whitworth (671)
18 Armstrong-Whitworth Warspite
36 Armstrong-Whitworth AW.249 AEW
48 Gloster Lions (48 RCAF)
120 Gloster P.462 Reaper (72 Mexico, 48 Persia)
219 Fairey Fireflies
102 Fairey Rotodynes
64 Fairey Swordfish ASW
64 Hawker-Siddeley Hurricanes

Hawker-Siddeley (780)
176 H-S Harriers/Sea Harriers (48 Germany, 96 Italy, 32 Sweden)
400 Hawker-Siddeley Hurricanes
24 Hawker Siddeley HS.681 Skyblazers
120 Blackburn Buccaneers (80 RN, 20 India, 20 Germany)
24 Avro Vulcans
24 Avro 780 Andover
12 Avro Vindicators

BAC/Bristol (690)
32 Bristol Buckinghams
72 Bristol Bulldogs
170 Bristol Strikemaster (40 RAF, 85 RIAF, 45 Sth Vietnam)
80 English Electric Lightnings (40 RAF, 40 India)
192 English Electric Scimitars
80 Folland-Miles Wasps
64 Hawker-Siddeley Hurricanes

[Simon Darkshade]

December Notes:
- The Ministry of Space report focuses on the areas somewhat traditional to British imperial interests - colonisation, mining and commercial development - with the Martian Lagrangian stations tacked on as the pure research interest of the Mos Science Department. The direct flight spaceship connection is based on the @ NASA plan for a 125 day round trip to Mars and the earlier experimental American test flight in the 1960s; a shorter voyage between Earth and Mars makes for more trade and more money, but also more general intercourse, which carries with it issues of its own
- The Soviets don't come out and say they are renouncing the Atmospheric Test Ban Treaty and indeed aren't doing so. However, just as not every car accident is intentional and not every pool of water is potentially malign, doesn't mean that there are other problems in the shadows: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNPMYRlvySY (To explain the relevance of the darkly bemusing British advertisement: Under the water there are hidden traps and problems...) On another note, the number of atomic devices may seem an excessive flourish, but comes directly from the @ estimate of ~250
- Guatemalan rumblings around British Honduras occurred around this time historically, being stamped upon with the relatively light touch available to @ Britain; the DE British Empire is a different proposition and the lessons of this episode will be felt throughout Latin America (hint, hint). The Guatemalan regime will seek to project its 'antsy-ness' in a different direction. St. George is the name of @ Belize City
- December 4th's event sees a visiting reporter from The Daily Planet interrupting the kidnapping of Steven Stayner, a very tragic case all round for the family https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Stayner
- The reduction in the active divisional strength of the British Army is perhaps the only way that it would be politically viable/possible
- Auden received the most votes in nomination for the @ Literature Nobel, whilst there was no @ 1972 Peace Prize (on account of the ongoing Vietnam War among other reasons), so Atticus Finch's win isn't at anyone's 'cost'
- To us, informed by a history of Middle Eastern wars and one in particular happening in 1973, we are almost conditioned to read more into the likes of December 7th's events than are actually there. Or are they?
- Austria-Hungary spending big comes in stages, as their previous generation of MDAP weapons now need to be replaced. This doesn't mean they are buying British alone (they have their joint Leopard tank programme with ze Germans for one) and some interesting other bits will come in 1973
- The Average Briton data is a bit of very small teaser of some more expansive lists of costs, prices and details that will come out eventually. The broad thrust is that wages are quite a bit higher, even accounting for the wealthier country, inflation (and consequently prices) are quite a bit lower and the biggies of houses and cars are well within the grasp of the 'average man on the street'
- I slapped in mention of the Unterwegs, a dwarven underground road network in Austria, as a bit of a flavour event, but thinking about it more, it has some interesting consequences during earlier times and wars
- Someone is apparently trying to pit the Soviets and Chinese against each other, or so it might seem...
- Reading back on December 12th, I must have been in a particularly devious frame of mind the other day, as this is the third or fourth potential fake out/actual tip to a future event that I put in the first fortnight of the bally month! :lol
- ARPANET expands faster, with the general pace of computing technology starting to resemble Moore's law in some ways. An earlier PC revolution + an advanced internet (equivalent to the c. late 1980s/early 1990s pre WWW) in the 1970s proper will have a lot of consequences, both technological and social; the latter is the area I look forward to delving into
- Jane's Fighting Ships corrects the tendency (from @ also) of the 1960s to classify submarines (and amphibs for some reason) right up at the start of their national sections; this event also allowed me to signpost the ending of the WW2 warship era, which begs for a short, short story
- Leonard Nimoy not catching Keyser Soze would be just...illogical
- Global cooling seems to be worrying more and more folk at the top; a sign of a different universe
- World cricket is much tighter, but some names will always shine through
- Pre-pre Columbian underground cities pose some interesting questions
- Dyna-Soar has seen a lot of testing and is finally in its pomp, just to see its effective replacement on the horizon
- The Managua earthquake is a historic tragedy, unfortunately, but the response does show the different positions of states in a circumstances akin to detente in some ways and where the politics of aid are one of many considerations
- Passengers aboard SS Poseidon have a great adventure on Christmas Eve, but honestly, there's no need to go overboard about it
- Ebenezer Cratchit carries the Christian name of his family's benefactor
- Imelda Marcos and shoe puns are a match made in...Manila...
- The electric car running out of power cord is inspired by a fake advertisement in an early episode of The Goodies
- Brawling over the butterfly effect is perhaps a bit of an intertextual comment about alternate history discussion over the electric internets. I threw in a Sealion joke for good measure
- Pan Am offering family flights to Disney Moon World on Luna is many things - a bit of fun, a story hook if I ever get around to it and a measure of difference
- The meteor shower is perfectly natural. Nothing to see here, move along people

[Simon Darkshade]

I’m going to put together a few more prices/cost of living tomorrow, as that is an area of social history that I quite enjoy.

Just to provide some context as to how they will be a bit different, beyond the basic level, is to remember that in @ 1972, Britain had a miners strike and quite profound inflation, with the three day week, energy blackouts and record current account deficits following in 73 and 74. None of that is present here, but sometimes the profound nature of the difference can be best illustrated at the coalface of food, household goods, petrol, holidays, cars, houses, luxuries and so forth. As Harper Lee (through the mouthpiece of Atticus Finch) might put it, this helps us get into someone’s shoes and walk around in them for a while.

I’ve got the data to extend the comparison across the Atlantic, so there’ll be something from there as well.

[jemhouston]

Back in the 70s, all the smart people were moaning about a coming ice age. Then they switched to global warming, now climate change. I always thought it would funny if when they stopped global warming, another ice age come roaring from the north.

[Simon Darkshade]

1972 Cost of Living (Britain)

Average annual salary of £2754 or £52.96/week

New house £4236
Colour television £95
Men's watch: £5-10
Pocket calculator: £49
New family car £529
Transistor radio: £4
Gramophone: £15
Washing Machine: £65
Electric Typewriter: £12
Sewing Machine: £25
Polaroid Camera: £7

Pint of Bitter: 6p
Packet of 20 cigarettes: 1s 6d
Bottle of whisky: £2 6s
Fish and Chips (1 serve): 2s
Box of Matches: 1/2d
Rent (1 bedroom flat): £2/week
Diamond engagement ring: £25+
32 volume set of Encyclopedia Britannica: £96
Paperback Novel: 2s
Newspaper: 1p
First class stamp: 1p
Gallon of Petrol: 4s
Cinema ticket: 2s
Monopoly: £1 2/4
Box of 20 .303" bullets: £1

Pair of men's socks: 1s
Men's shirt: 2s
Woman's dress: £6
Suit: £20
Men's overcoat: £12
London to Manchester 1 way rail ticket: £1 4s second class/ £2 5s first class
London to Edinburgh 1 way: £3 4s second class/£5 2s first class

Feeding a Family of Five for a Week on £13 10/6

Essentials: £1 11s 3d
Pint of Milk (3d) x 21 5s 3d
White Sliced Loaf (6d) x 7 3s 6d
1lb Cheddar (3s) x 2 6s
1/4lb of Tea (2s) 2s
2 x 1lb of Butter (2s) 4s
2 x 3lb flour 1s
3 dozen eggs 3s
3 x 12oz Cornflakes 3s
2lb Oats 1s 6d
2 x 2lb sugar 2s
1lb Lard/Dripping 1s

Pantry: £1 5s 6d
Tinned Soup: 1s
Tinned Carrots: 1s
Tinned Green Beans: 1s
Tinned Peas: 1s
Tinned Baked Beans: 1s
Tinned Stewed Steak: 2/6
Tinned Salmon: 2s
Tinned Sardines: 1s
Tinned Ham: 4s
Tin of Corned Beef: 3s
Tinned Peaches 2s
Tinned Pineapple 2s
Tinned Strawberries 2s
Tinned Fruit Cocktail 2s

Meat: £6 15s 6d
2lb Bacon 10s
2lb pork sausages: 10s
2lb New Zealand lamb chops £1
5lb beef sirloin joint: £2 6/4
2 1/2 lb beef rump steak: £2 1/2
1 chicken 8s

(2lb minced beef: £1)
(5lb leg of mutton £2)
(2lb corned beef: £1)
(2lb ham: £1)

Sauces/Condiments: 8s
12oz Heinz ketchup 1s
12oz Heinz salad cream 1s
16oz Jar of Honey 2s
16oz Jar of Strawberry Jam 2s
16oz Jar of Marmalade 2s

Fish: 8s
1lb Kippers: 1s
2lb Cod: 5s
2lb Fish Fingers: 4s

Fruit: 12s 8 d
2lb Apples: 6d
1lb Pears: 3d
1lb Bananas: 6d
1lb Strawberries: 4d
1lb Oranges: 2s 1d
1lb Grapes: 3s
2 pints Orange Juice: 6s

Vegetables: £1 5s
10lb potatoes: 8s
4lb cabbage: 2s
3lb carrots: 3s
2 x 2lb peas: 2s
2lb onions: 2s
2lb cauliflower: 2s
2lb turnips/swedes: 6d
2lb tomatoes: 2s
2lb cucumber: 1s 6d
4lb lettuce: 2s

Assorted: 10s 8 d
Large pack of crisps 1s
8oz bar Cadbury's Dairy Milk Chocolate 1s
1 packet of Paxo stuffing 6d
1 packet chocolate biscuits 6s
1lb sweets 2d
2lb Ice Cream: 2s

[Simon Darkshade]

Back in the 70s, all the smart people were moaning about a coming ice age. Then they switched to global warming, now climate change. I always thought it would funny if when they stopped global warming, another ice age come roaring from the north.

It is a bit difficult to map the precise currents of opinion, as there has been a lot of ‘scorched earth’ editing of accounts to fit with current thinking and more broadly with the modern tendency that even the past must be made to bow to the present. From the available evidence, it doesn’t seem that the @ situation was quite as widespread as to be universal or ‘all the smart people’.

The Dark Earth situation does occur in a different universe with different laws of nature that in some cases don’t work as they should. On top of that, it channels the many non-scientific pop cultural manifestations of the ‘global cooling epoch’, such as science fiction and fantasy novels set in a near future ice age, the likes of the episode of ‘In Search Of’ entitled ‘In Search of the Coming Ice Age’ from 1978 and this dated piece from 1958: https://harpers.org/archive/1958/09/the-coming-ice-age/

Like many writers, I’m a bit more interested in the paths not taken than rehashing every miserable thing that has occurred historically; the former way provides for more mystery and mist.

[farmerted777]

1972 Cost of Living (Britain)

Average annual salary of £2754 or £52.96/week

New house £4236
Colour television £95
Men's watch: £5-10
Pocket calculator: £49
New family car £529
Transistor radio: £4
Gramophone: £15
Washing Machine: £65
Electric Typewriter: £12
Sewing Machine: £25
Polaroid Camera: £7

Pint of Bitter: 6p
Packet of 20 cigarettes: 1s 6d
Bottle of whisky: £2 6s
Fish and Chips (1 serve): 2s
Box of Matches: 1/2d
Rent (1 bedroom flat): £2/week
Diamond engagement ring: £25+
32 volume set of Encyclopedia Britannica: £96
Paperback Novel: 2s
Newspaper: 1p
First class stamp: 1p
Gallon of Petrol: 4s
Cinema ticket: 2s
Monopoly: £1 2/4
Box of 20 .303" bullets: £1

Pair of men's socks: 1s
Men's shirt: 2s
Woman's dress: £6
Suit: £20
Men's overcoat: £12
London to Manchester 1 way rail ticket: £1 4s second class/ £2 5s first class
London to Edinburgh 1 way: £3 4s second class/£5 2s first class

Feeding a Family of Five for a Week on £18 10/6

Essentials: £1 11s 3d
Pint of Milk (3d) x 21 5s 3d
White Sliced Loaf (6d) x 7 3s 6d
1lb Cheddar (3s) x 2 6s
1/4lb of Tea (2s) 2s
2 x 1lb of Butter (2s) 4s
2 x 3lb flour 1s
3 dozen eggs 3s
3 x 12oz Cornflakes 3s
2lb Oats 1s 6d
2 x 2lb sugar 2s
1lb Lard/Dripping 1s

Pantry: £1 5s 6d
Tinned Soup: 1s
Tinned Carrots: 1s
Tinned Green Beans: 1s
Tinned Peas: 1s
Tinned Baked Beans: 1s
Tinned Stewed Steak: 2/6
Tinned Salmon: 2s
Tinned Sardines: 1s
Tinned Ham: 4s
Tin of Corned Beef: 3s
Tinned Peaches 2s
Tinned Pineapple 2s
Tinned Strawberries 2s
Tinned Fruit Cocktail 2s

Meat: £11 15s 6d
4lb Bacon £1
2lb New Zealand lamb chops £1
5lb leg of mutton £2
2lb corned beef: £1
2lb ham: £1
5lb beef sirloin joint: £2 6/4
2 1/2 lb beef rump steak: £2 1/2
2lb minced beef: £1
4lb pork sausages: £1
1 chicken 8s

Sauces/Condiments: 8s
12oz Heinz ketchup 1s
12oz Heinz salad cream 1s
16oz Jar of Honey 2s
16oz Jar of Strawberry Jam 2s
16oz Jar of Marmalade 2s

Fish: 8s
1lb Kippers: 1s
2lb Cod: 5s
2lb Fish Fingers: 4s

Fruit: 12s 8 d
2lb Apples: 6d
1lb Pears: 3d
1lb Bananas: 6d
1lb Strawberries: 4d
1lb Oranges: 2s 1d
1lb Grapes: 3s
2 pints Orange Juice: 6s

Vegetables: £1 5s
10lb potatoes: 8s
4lb cabbage: 2s
3lb carrots: 3s
2 x 2lb peas: 2s
2lb onions: 2s
2lb cauliflower: 2s
2lb turnips/swedes: 6d
2lb tomatoes: 2s
2lb cucumber: 1s 6d
4lb lettuce: 2s

Assorted: 10s 8 d
Large pack of crisps 1s
8oz bar Cadbury's Dairy Milk Chocolate 1s
1 packet of Paxo stuffing 6d
1 packet chocolate biscuits 6s
1lb sweets 2d
2lb Ice Cream: 2s

I take it that Decimalisation isn't gonna fly here.

[Simon Darkshade]

There is less of a push for it. The move to decimalisation was a post WW2 development and indeed a post 1950s development. Once the likes of Australia, NZ and South Africa changed, then Britain was the last man standing, but the impetus came also from within. In DE, Canada, Newfoundland, New Avalon, Australia, NZ, South Africa, Rhodesia, Israel, Prydain and the West Indies all use non-decimal pounds and other countries have not decimalised, such as India, Persia, the Southern Cone, Abyssinia, Ceylon, Siam and the Arab Union.

The historical decimalisation occurred in 1971 on the back of ‘British Government introduction of the Committee of the Inquiry on Decimal Currency, whose 1963 report resulted in the final agreement to adopt decimalisation on 1 March 1966, with the approval of the Decimal Currency Act in May 1969.’ ( https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/H ... n-Britain/ ).

Whilst a decimal currency is simple to those who have grown up with it, the same applies to a non-decimal one. Any advantage with regard to foreign trade is extremely minimal, given the necessity for changing currency in any event. In general, British traditionalism is strong.


* = British decimalisation needs to be placed in the context of a broader move to SI/decimal measures across the board in @, driven in turn by a sense of being left behind. In DE this gets tarred with an ideological and nationalist brush; the metric system is seen, rightly or wrongly, as the product of the French and Russian Revolutions and ‘nasty foreign muck’.

[Simon Darkshade]

I’ve made some small adjustments to the previous post, based on revision of the amount of food (meat) reasonably consumed in an average week, with some other prices now indicated in brackets to provide additional context beyond the sample grocery list.

This takes the price down to £13 10/6, but that is likely to be a bit lower in many cases on account of:
- Home vegetable gardens/allotments
- A very large number of people keeping chickens for eggs
- Free school dinners providing for five meals a week for the children of many families

By the end of 1973, with further advances in modern farming techniques, there could be a fall towards the £10 mark, even accounting for more meat and fish consumption. With falling power prices and consistently low petrol prices, this is going to further keep the general cost of living under control.

A few other potential/general expenses:

Wedding: £800
Child’s bicycle: £20
Teddy Bear: 12s
New D&D game: £2 5s
Monthly Electricity bill: £5 2/6
British Railways Monthly Season Ticket: £10
Week’s Holiday for 5 at Butlin’s: £49
Week’s Holiday for 2 in Minorca: £125
Mortgage: £87
Week’s Family Holiday for 5 in West Indies: £300
Monthly Mortgage: £16
Year’s School Fees at Eton: £525
Year’s Minor Public School Fees: £240

Income tax for Mr. Average, on the aforementioned annual wage of £2754, is £300 16s, based on a generally lighter individual burden than @.

How? Historically in 1972, the first £2500 was taxed at 25%, with sums over that charged at a quite high rate: (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/19 ... view=plain )

Excess Rate
The first £500 35%
The next £500 37.5%
The next £1,000 42.5%
The next £1,000 47.5%
The next £1,000 52.5%
The next £2,000 57.5%
The next £2,000 62.5%
The next £2,000 67.5%
The next £3,000 72.5%
The remainder 75%

Dark Earth:

Tax Brackets:
0-£2500: 10%
£2500-£5000: 20%
£5000-£10000: 25%
£10000-£20000: 35%
£20000+: 40%

Thus, Mr Average pays 10% of his first £2500 (£250) and 20% of the other £254 (£50 16s); in @ Britain, he’d be slugged £713 18s.

[However, it important to remember that he would be ‘Mr. Above Average’ in the @ Britain of 1972, where the average adult male weekly income was £36.60, making his tax bill around £475.75; the different prices and inflation also play merry heck with the situation.]

(A Bit on Tax

There has been discussion, by all three major parties, for the introduction of a tax free threshold for low income earners and movement on this is expected during the life of the new Parliament. As a general observation, as in many progressive tax systems, the large majority of the overall income tax ‘take’ comes from the highest brackets; in DE 1972, income tax is equivalent to 11% of the British GDP of £241,554,419,577. Of the labour force of ~79.5 million, the most tax from a group doesn’t come from the low income earners or Mr Average, but from the millionaires and indeed from those in ‘Very Wealthy’ category who earn above £100,000 a year (equivalent to $4.255 million 2024 USD, FWIW)).

He also pays £68 17s in National Insurance, for a total individual tax burden of £369 12s; VAT is incorporated into the cost of goods, along with excise, so our friend doesn’t need to do any calculations on that.

Shifting back onto food, the nominal amount that can be purchased for a lower percentage of an average male wage is substantively higher (Factoring in that ~42% of all adult women are also in the workforce and earn ~60% of the average male wage, total family income for some is even higher) and most often of a better quality.

Broadly speaking, there are far fewer processed foodstuffs, a greater proportion and availability of fresh fruit and vegetables, less snacking and availability of what we would term convenience food and virtually no ‘ready meals’.


Notes on Food from c. 1968
In Britain, food and drink standards haven't undergone the same degree of decline due to the World Wars and rationing as in @ and the culinary situation and tastes are quite Edwardian, with some differences. One is the preference for English rather than French names and labelling that grew out of traditional rivalries. The general diet of the working classes has greatly improved and there is increasing diversity of food stuffs from around the Empire and world.

- The combination of Imperial/Commonwealth food politics and domestic agricultural policy means there is quite a lot of produce available at steady prices.
- The lack of the impact of postwar austerity and rationing has meant there wasn’t the same drop off in relative quality and standards of cuisine.
- In general, there is more and better fruits and vegetables available; and more meat is consumed on a per capital basis.
- Milk and dairy consumption is quite high.
- Changes in migration patterns have meant that Indian and Chinese restaurants are still confined to the largest cities, rather than starting to spread out. The historical British culinary interest in curry has just started to really take off at this point, but here is somewhat muted and comes in the form of more Anglo-Indian adaptions: rather than a butter chicken and rice, one would find a beef curry with vegetables, onions and curry powder served with mashed potatoes.
- When Indian restaurants start to spread, they will have a much more esteemed position/cultural cachet, as well as serving some of the more elaborate dishes.
- Persian restaurants have started to spread around the great international cities in a much heavier way and more distinctly.
- Likewise, a somewhat different style of West Indian/Caribbean cooking is diffusing internationally, combining the Caribbean elements of @ with the different Anglo-Cuban evolution of that cuisine.
- Some wartime nastiness with Italy did cause some damage to the number of Italian restaurants, cafes, ice cream sellers and so forth that began to increase from the 1950s in @. Pasta is largely unknown, saved for tinned spaghetti and macaroni, and pizza is an alien foreign delicacy.
- Fewer Berni Inns as of 1968 (as compared to 1970), but other steakhouses, chophouses and carveries are a bit more common, with higher standard fare and larger portions. Their identity and style is deliberately very stereotypically British (read John Bull and The Roast Beef of Olde England) as a result of cultural differentiation and subtle government encouragement.
- Continued Ministry of Food run British Restaurants provide set menus cheaply, both as an aid to public nutrition and as a skeleton/cadre structure for expansion into wartime/crisis public feeding.
- Beyond some limited London restaurants and some places near larger US bases, the hamburger is yet to take off. There was no Wimpy’s franchise opening by Lyons in 1954.
- The major British ‘fast food’ is fish and chips, followed by meat pies and various types of roast/corned meat sandwiches.
- Pub opening and closing times were regulated to a slightly reduced degree during each world war and quickly reverted to the pre 1915 norm in 1919 and 1946 respectively, which allowed for opening between 0900 and midnight, with many city pubs and those near large factories/shipyards/armaments works having licences to open beyond and outside the norm.
- Off licences by and large don’t exist in the same broad fashion.
- No pubs are permitted to open on Sundays.
- Fish consumption is high, driven by supply and MoF encouragement, which in turn is motivated by the multiple uses/strategic value of the fishing fleet. Fish on Friday is a widely followed tradition on cultural grounds.
- There is no dearth of flavour, as some commentators have pejoratively ascribed to British food of the 1960s in @, which comes from the base quality and natural tastes of the foodstuffs, use of quite a lot of traditional herbs, no decline in the medieval/early modern English popularity of garlic and some rather special new inventions.
- These are a combination of @ spices, flavoured salts, MSG and equivalents and a bit of a fantastical Willy Wonka approach; think what Heston Blumenthal and his ilk could accomplish with real culinary magic.
- The other major food related areas where magic has played a role are storage/preservation (a subsection of which is military rations) and cooking devices. There are ovens that can roast a 25lb turkey to perfection in half an hour, cook 12 dishes differently and simultaneously and other such ‘marvels’. Frozen meals can be heated quickly with a fair bit better quality.
- More venison is generally available and mutton and veal retain their respective niches.
- Chip pans have been replaced by safer household deep fryers.
- Beer is served at 36 degrees Fahrenheit which, due to some magically assisted developments over the centuries, results in no loss of flavour profile, which is a bit richer, due to continued use of gruyt herbs as well as hops.
- Dwarven ale is stronger (16-25%), richer in taste and through some secret process, contains a fair whack of the necessary calories, vitamins and minerals needed for nominal survival, although not the lot.
- The halflings population is quite ‘food centric’ and provides many of the great cooks of England, as well as instructors at military culinary schools.
- French cuisine has less of a cachet/hold over the popular imagination as the epitome of food excellence. One of the unfortunate byproducts, from an external universe perspectives, of greater prosperity has been the lack of a breakthrough for Mediterranean cuisine as achieved by Elizabeth David in @
- School dinners/lunches are still provided in the majority of institutions, along with free orange juice and milk.
- More wine is made in southern England and Lyonesse, but perhaps half of it is grape wine and the rest is various forms of fruit wine.
- Television chefs have made earlier inroads, with Julia Child, Graham Kerr, Fanny Craddock, Delia Smith (five years before @) and James Beard all making inroads. Keith Floyd will be joining their ranks sooner as one of my rare personal taste inserts, as I enjoy him a great deal.
- Martian and Venusian dishes are really out of this world.
- As a general rule, whether in the USA, Britain, Europe or the wider world, that golden moment of regional cuisines/styles combined with modern tech and capacity has extended a little longer.