History, Politics And Current Affairs

The 120mm Mortars are coming!
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120mm mortars are coming to at least Battalion level in the British Army, and perhaps Company level, supplanting 81mm (pictured).

The driver is that both British Army development groups (Dstl, ETG and NGCT) and feedback from Ukraine has determined the 120mm sized mortar bomb as the weight of infantry operated indirect fire required for both Urban and Open battlefields moving forward.

The 120mm mortar advantage

As presented by RUSI, Dstl, ETG, NGCT, USSOCOM, Future Force Capabilities Conference in the last year to name a few:

In the Urban, the 120mm shell has the weight to punch through buildings and the payload to deliver effect through rubble and barriers.

In the Open, 120mm systems have the reach to strike targets at distance and the payload to deliver effect to trenches and fortifications.

The larger 120mm shell also delivers more smoke and IR/Visible illumination for longer from further away.

Different types of Tubes

Battalions and Companies in the British Army come in different roles. 120mm tubes will look different depending on the unit. The traditional downsides of the weight and ammunition carriage of the 120mm system vs 81mm has been ameliorated by vehicle carriage.

At the heavy end, the Armoured Mortar Vehicle (AMV) is likely to be NEMO turreted 120mm mortar.

This has a high rate of sustained fire with a longer range, protecting the crew from concussion. It also sports MRSI, Direct fire and Fire on the move.

This is the right choice of system at the Armoured end for me. Open topped turntables are as expensive, generally require more Operators to be exposed at once and do not quite reach the same effect.

Initially we will see it on the Boxer, perhaps in time on an Ares chassis or other similar IFV/APC platform in British service.

That leaves the bulk of the Infantry. Light Mechanised, even Light Infantry.

The Light Mortar Vehicle (LMV) is likely to be a folding/hinged mortar system that can be carried by a range of vehicles such as Jackal/Coyote or the solution selected for the LM Light/Medium programmes.

Babcock / ST Engineering have partnered to bring mortar manufacturing to the UK, with Babcock to fully manufacture the ST Engineering GDAMS in the UK.

I like this system in particular. It exposes only a crew of two, allowing the rest of the team to stay in cover and plan/prep/hide fire missions. Unlike similar systems, Babcock are already bringing fabrication/manufacture to the UK, now.

GDAMS has also been seen not only on protected 4x4's (pictured) but also a Toyota Land Cruiser. Babcock armour the Land Cruiser for civilian use and are offering the GLV version for LM Utility (Land Rover replacement). It's a good fit. Also expect to see GDAMS on a Jackal/Coyote soon.

The collaboration also unlocks more than just mortar systems from ST Engineering being able to be manufactured by Babcock in the UK. More details on that collaboration here:

edrmagazine.eu/%E2%96%BA-babc…

Munitions are the key

Critical to both turreted and hinged 120mm mortar systems is manufacturing the mortar bombs and carrier vehicles (the type of shell that contains smoke, illumination, etc) here in the UK.

At the moment we do not. We manufacture a lot of 81mm.

The NEMO trials for the British Army are being supplied by Nammo for the time being.

The Army also put out a Request for the Order of Magnitude (ROM) to supply 6,000 120mm mortar bombs and carrier vehicles back in February.

You can read that ROM here:

bidstats.uk/tenders/2024/W…

This number of mortars, independent from the Nammo/NEMO supply, indicates the development of CONOPS/CONEMP for another system.

Shortly after the ROM was announced, BAE updated their 81mm munitions page to note that they are developing 120mm versions.

You can read that here:

baesystems.com/en/product/81m…

What is lacking in the BAE supply however are extended range and precision guided mortars.

Continuing the ST Engineering news, they are open to supplying their own 120mm mortar designs which add these ER and Guided natures to BAE and other manufacturers.

The 6,000 mortar bomb ROM means we should expect to see a separate crew served 120mm system borrowed from an Ally in the coming months to allow the Infantry to get to grips with the larger shell.

The tube they are experimenting with itself will be less important than the experience being gained.

What are British Army fires looking like?

The Army is currently looking broadly like:

MLRS (Royal Artillery, HIMARS-a-like if sensible)
155mm (Royal Artillery, RCH155 if sensible)
120mm (Infantry Btln level, Company if sensible)
Loitering Munitions (Company/Platoon level)
40mm (Section level, including GMG)

This is separate to Overwatch and other roles such as NLAW, Javelin, Machine Gun, Carl Gustaf, LMM/Martlet, 70mm, Brimstone, etc.

Improvements in 40mm and Loitering Munitions together with moving 120mm down to Company level means that 60mm and 81mm are supplanted in the majority case. I think it's important to remember that they are still available.

Without needing wrap payload in such a heavy shell to protect it from launching from the tube that is also being lugged around, Loitering Munitions mean that at the soldier-portable end (Paras, Rangers, etc) more explosive and more predictable effect can be carried per person, by more people, than a 60mm or 81mm system.

Summary

120mm turreted and hinged mortar systems are coming. Together with the changes to Artillery at higher levels and increased fires at the Platoon level, we are seeing a large uplift in measurable Infantry 'lethality' in the British Army.

NotThatBen wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 6:12 pmWhy not Archer? already being procured as a stop gap IIRC.

Pdf27 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 6:39 pm

NotThatBen wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 6:12 pmWhy not Archer? already being procured as a stop gap IIRC.

Would need new-build Archer, rather than being able to run on the stop-gap hardware. RCH155 has far more UK content and is generally a higher performing solution.

Micael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:25 pmI would put it slightly differently. It depends on what the expected user case is. If you want to be able to negotiate deep snow or mud for instance, the Archer in its original form is going to outperform the RCH155 in a major way. Something that may be of relevance given the renewed focus on the north.

Pdf27 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:38 pm

Micael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:25 pmI would put it slightly differently. It depends on what the expected user case is. If you want to be able to negotiate deep snow or mud for instance, the Archer in its original form is going to outperform the RCH155 in a major way. Something that may be of relevance given the renewed focus on the north.

That isn't on offer - the bid submitted for Archer is to put it on a MAN 8x8 truck chassis. I'm not familiar with the details of how Boxer compares with the A30D chassis, but it's certainly pretty decent and I'd be stunned if it wasn't significantly more capable than the MAN option.

kdahm wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 9:13 pm I thought the British had already done this. Just grab a Universal Carrier, put a 120mm mortar in the back, and done.

Micael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 10:28 pm

kdahm wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 9:13 pm I thought the British had already done this. Just grab a Universal Carrier, put a 120mm mortar in the back, and done.

A fully enclosed armored solution is more survivable in the current battlefield environment with both counter battery fire and drones threating these indirect fire platforms.

Micael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:52 pmYeah, and the reason for that being bid I’ve been told is that that’s what the customer was asking for (behind the scenes). It’s unfortunately also led to the new order Archers for the Swedish army to be on the MAN chassis as well, some numbnuts is trying to help export by getting the design work done for that version. The actual people who use it in the army are absolutely, positively livid about it. A30 is seen as far superior (plus it fits three instead of two crew members.)

The A30 is unmatched in forested, muddy, snowy terrain among the wheeled platforms. Only some tracked solutions can match or surpass its performance there. It is after all originally a forestry work platform intended for very tricky terrain management. In the terrain up here on the Scandinavian peninsula those 8x8 solutions (Boxer and MAN etc.) in the weight classes we’re talking about here are going to be heavily dependent on roads, with more and more limited ability to go off road the further north you get. That’s a major concern for us, and if there is an intent for the British Army to be able to operate here (as seems to be the case), that should weigh into the calculation. I hope that some sane person here is going to reverse the decision to go for the MAN solution for our order.

Bernard Woolley wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 8:50 pmI’m going to be that person and ask what’s actually wrong with AS90 that spending some money on it to make more vehicles operational won’t fix? Have to say I’m sort of attracted to the AHS Krab, since it is very similar to the AS90. I wonder if we could simply fit the 52cal barrel to our existing AS90 fleet? Or buy Krab turrets, which are AS90M turrets anyway.

Bernard Woolley wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 8:50 pmHaving seen video of RCH-155 firing, I do worry that it will wear out its suspension fairly quickly. I’d prefer to upgrade, or buy a proven system, rather than buy something just because it looks shiny and alley.

Bernard Woolley wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:01 pmIf AS90 is worn out, I’d plumb for Krab. Out of interest, are our AS90s worn out because they haven’t been looked after properly, or just that they’ve been worked very hard?

Zen9 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:17 pm How much of Boxer RCH155 is going to be made in the UK?

German licensed production?

Zen9 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:17 pmBraveheart is BAE Systems (UK) license.

Zen9 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:17 pmWho are we fighting alongside besides the US in NATO, where these will be used in quantity ?

Zen9 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 09, 2024 9:09 pmIt all curious how tied up with Germany this sector has become.

Strategically this is either a very good move or a very bad one. I'm not sure which at the moment.