General Discussion Thread

[Matt Wiser]

Wartime version and the latter one as well. Both versions in some Western European countries were viewed with some skepticism until the various "turnovers in government" happened in 1987.

[Wolfman]

Over on Lordroel’s board, he’s got Frunze being sunk in a Battle of Kamchatka… but ISTR that it was sunk in the aftermath of the Seattle Amphib attack…

[Lordroel]

Over on Lordroel’s board, he’s got Frunze being sunk in a Battle of Kamchatka… but ISTR that it was sunk in the aftermath of the Seattle Amphib attack…

Found the text i used in the Red Dawn 20+ AH.com archive, as it was writen by Matt, i toughed it was canon:

Well, halfway through Keegan's naval chapter. The Battle of Kamchatka is pretty well described as the swan song of the Soviet Pacific Fleet. The raid on Petropavalosk brought out the carriers Minsk and Novosoryssk, along with the Kirov-class battle cruiser Freunze, to face the Carl Vinson and Enterprise battle groups. In a way, the amphibious force was a decoy, to draw the SOVPACFLT out to do battle. The sub force did its job, sinking the Freunze and getting the main anti-air warfare and anti-surface threat out of the way in the process. The Soviet commander wanted to turn back, was was turned down by his Fleet Command in Vladivostok, and it turned out to be a death-and-glory ride. In a nutshell, both carriers were sunk, along with an additional cruiser (Ochakov), three destroyers (one Kashin and two Sovremenny class ships), and one of their precious fleet replenishment ships. U.S. losses: one cruiser (Richmond K. Turner) sunk, two destroyers (Coontz and Hayler) also sunk, and the frigate Downes so badly damaged she had to be scuttled. Air losses: four A-7s, seven A-6s, three F/A-18s, and one S-3. Not a bad day's work, fellas. As a result, the Soviet Pacific Fleet never did venture out in force beyond the range of land-based air, and the supply line to Alaska was now even more tenuous. Sloreck-this was your op-the Raid on Petropavalosk. Keegan thinks well of you guys.

[Wolfman]

Thanks for the reminder. I had forgotten.

[Lordroel]

Thanks for the reminder. I had forgotten.

Only thing we need form Matt is the year it took place, myself i think in the 1987 to 1988 period.

[Matt Wiser]

There were three raids on Kamchatka: the first was more of a hit-and-run to divert things from PRAIRIE FIRE. The second was the big one, with the death ride of Freunze and the two carriers.

[Poohbah]

There were three raids on Kamchatka: the first was more of a hit-and-run to divert things from PRAIRIE FIRE. The second was the big one, with the death ride of Freunze and the two carriers.

Actually, the first was in late '86, the Navy was exploiting the advantage won at Puget Sound. The primary goal was to wreck the Petropavlovsk base complex and the Pacific Fleet Backfire force, and it was about 80% accomplished.

[Lordroel]

Seems that veteran of the Falklands War and World War III, the former Royal Navy frigate HMS Ambuscade to be brought back to UK next year as Pakistan has donated the ship to the Clyde Naval Heritage where it will serve as a museum ship.

[Bernard Woolley]

I wish them luck, given the failure of a number of other similar projects. Looks like they haven't chosen a site for the museum yet.

[Poohbah]

Well, Roberta and I joined our son and daughter-in-law for Thanksgiving at Sijan AFB outside Sherman, Oklahoma. I prepared scalloped potatoes, my wife made a cinnamon apple pie from scratch, Michael deep-fried a turkey in the backyard, and Jessica made her family's homemade stuffing and gravy.

Jessica also informed us that she's two months along, with a due date of early July. (She is quietly hoping for July 4th.)

Boss-Ma'am called to share her good news: Danielle (her second-youngest, by all of a few minutes) is engaged to fine young man she met while working in Newport Beach.

She met him at Twain's Down Under, aka "Costa Mesa's Biggest Meat Market."

He's an King Stallion driver with Marine Heavy Helicopter Squadron 466--my alma mater.



Roberta and I are insufferably pleased with ourselves. Sophie is wondering where she went wrong and is saying that Danielle's Uncle Josh has obviously been a horrible influence on her. Adam is planning on making sure the wedding cake has crayons.

[Wolfman]

Pass along my congratulations to Sophie’s next-to-youngest for me, will you?

[jemhouston]

Congrats to the happy couple.


It could be worse; he could have been a politician.

[Lordroel]

Guys, in the last week it seems the rebels in Syria are close to victor , Iran, the major backer to the Syrian Regime has made it clear, its on its own, it does not want to be dragged into a foolish decision that the Syrian Regime might make, like a certain Colonel in 2011.

[Matt Wiser]

I would not be surprised if the appropriate back-channel links have been used to convey to the Assad loyalists that any use of CW means that there will be instant sunshine, followed by mushrooms growing in the Syrian desert....And the rebels, too, if they decide to use the stuff. ANY use of WMD gets a U.S./UK nuclear response, and this has been policy since the end of the big war, but wasn't carried out until the Mad Colonel decided such things didn't apply to him.....He found out they did. For a millisecond, anyway.

[Lordroel]

I would not be surprised if the appropriate back-channel links have been used to convey to the Assad loyalists that any use of CW means that there will be instant sunshine, followed by mushrooms growing in the Syrian desert....And the rebels, too, if they decide to use the stuff. ANY use of WMD gets a U.S./UK nuclear response, and this has been policy since the end of the big war, but wasn't carried out until the Mad Colonel decided such things didn't apply to him.....He found out they did. For a millisecond, anyway.

Some news sources i have read said there where BAe Lancers ready to go at RAF Akrotiri, but of course the RAF after being asked by several new sources does not confirm that is the case.

[Matt Wiser]

SAC and Strike Command having bombers alerted and ready, just in case, would not be that surprising at all. There are ample non-nuclear options, but if there is CW use which results in a mass casualty event, then that's when the B-61s, WE-177s,ALCM/ACM, and the SRAM-IIs get loaded..... Just hope it doesn't come down to that.

[Lordroel]

SAC and Strike Command having bombers alerted and ready, just in case, would not be that surprising at all. There are ample non-nuclear options, but if there is CW use which results in a mass casualty event, then that's when the B-61s, WE-177s,ALCM/ACM, and the SRAM-IIs get loaded..... Just hope it doesn't come down to that.

Think Iran knew that, thats why they chose their own survival over supporting the Syrian Regime, to live a few more years.

We can now say the Middle Eastern Coalition now is mostly Iran and the terror organizations they support.

[Wolfman]

One can hope that that is the case, anyway…

[Poohbah]

Another day ending in "Y" in the Middle East...

[Wolfman]

Another day ending in "Y" in the Middle East...

All too true, Poohbah.