US Navy News

[Nightwatch2]

No we couldn't. USN can't have nice things.

Sadly

At this point we’d be a lot better off canceling the Constellation program and firing everyone involved.

Then go out and contract with the various foreign shipyards that are building modern frigates and accepting them as is with the only “modifications” being the translated documents to American English.

We’d at least get some hulls in the water.

It’s not that simple, as you know. Sensors, comms equipment, guns, etc also need translation to US kit. But that’s not the problem with CONSTELLATION.

It’s that the Navy and the US designers keep playing with the design as the poor shipyards are trying to build the damn things.

Aware of that. A certain degree of sarcasm combined with disgusted frustration.

It was supposed to be something like 85% common and 15% USN unique. They have managed to flip those percentages and still going downhill.

I can see some of those changes but they might as well started from a clean sheet as far as they have screwed this up.

At the rate they’re going, we could contract with a PLA shipyard and be better off. (Sarcasm) we need a Sarcasm button….

[Bernard Woolley]

Way things are going, we’ll be building the Type 83s by the Connies enter the water!

[Rocket J Squrriel]

It’s not that simple, as you know. Sensors, comms equipment, guns, etc also need translation to US kit. But that’s not the problem with CONSTELLATION.

It’s that the Navy and the US designers keep playing with the design as the poor shipyards are trying to build the damn things.

Aware of that. A certain degree of sarcasm combined with disgusted frustration.

It was supposed to be something like 85% common and 15% USN unique. They have managed to flip those percentages and still going downhill.

I can see some of those changes but they might as well started from a clean sheet as far as they have screwed this up.

At the rate they’re going, we could contract with a PLA shipyard and be better off. (Sarcasm) we need a Sarcasm button….

Makes you wonder if thee 85/15 wasn't the goal all along. Didn't USN have to shoved, nearly at gunpoint, by congress to consider a foreign design? They picked one and promptly redesigned it.

The USN would never purposely go out and do that, right?

[jemhouston]

Me too, Constellation, me too.

Seems we can upgrade it to destroyer as the Constellation frigate now has nearly the same displacement as a Flight I Arleigh Burke destroyer.

Really?

IMG_1021.jpeg

[Drunknsubmrnr]

You could have had the Type 26 you know.

The USN could not handle the Type 26. It only has 24 missile cells. The RAN has folded, spindled and mutilated the design to bump that to 32, but they’ve had to put more into redesigning it than the USN has put into Constellation.

Sounds like it’s time to relearn that you can’t actually put 10 pounds of Smarties in a 5 pound bag.

[Straker]

I thought the major problem the RAN has had in doing the design modifications from the baseline Type 26 was the weight of the CEAFAR arrays? The additional topweight was described as the biggest challenge in an interview that was done with BAE at one point. A topweight challenge that the Constellation class is also apparently having.

At one point I think the plan was to place the extra Mk41 module for the Hunter Class in the space where the UK version has the Sea Ceptor (CAMM) silo. I'm not sure what the current plan is as the usual cold vs hot launch issues have probably cropped up.

It's the CAMM silo that makes Type 26 a 48 Sea Ceptor plus 24 of whatever the RN can afford for the Mk41 system (rumours abound of an eventual purchase of VL ASROC and CAMM MR as a trade offset deal with Poland but Artisan arguably doesn't have enough performance to make it worthwhile).

Interesting that BAE are now pitching a version of the Hunter class thas is potentially 96 Mk41 cells "at minimal extra cost". Somehow I think the BAE version of minimal might not be the same as the RAN one.

[jemhouston]

From Battleship New Jersey https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4Q-ieUZjGI

@HaddaClu
11 minutes ago
Neat vid.
As an interesting side note - the US naval vessels tend to have more watertight hatches than their foreign counterparts. This was cited in a report as one of the reasons why the new Constellation Frigates are overweight from the original source design.
3

[James1978]

We have a nominee for Chief of Naval Operations - Admiral Daryl Caudle.
He is a career submariner. Though I am curious why it took this long.

Trump taps Fleet Forces head as Navy’s next chief of naval operations - Navy Times, 18 June 2025
Trump taps Caudle as Navy’s next leader, USMC’s Mahoney as joints chiefs No. 2 - Breaking Defense, 18 June 2024

Official Biography - Admiral Daryl Caudl

Adm. Daryl Caudle is a native of Winston-Salem, North Carolina and a 1985 graduate of North Carolina State University (magna cum laude) with a degree in chemical engineering. He was then commissioned after attending Officer Candidate School in Newport, Rhode Island. Caudle holds advanced degrees from the Naval Postgraduate School, Master of Science (distinction) in Physics; from Old Dominion University, and Master of Science in Engineering Management. He also attended the School of Advanced Studies, University of Phoenix, where he obtained a Doctor of Management in Organizational Leadership with a specialization in Information Systems and Technology.

His doctoral dissertation research was conducted on military decision making uncertainty regarding the use of force in cyberspace. He is also a licensed professional engineer.

He assumed command of U.S. Fleet Forces Command; U.S. Naval Forces Northern Command; U.S. Naval Forces Strategic Command; and U.S. Strategic Command Joint Force Maritime Component Commander on December 7, 2021.

Prior to this assignment, he served as commander, Submarine Forces; commander, Submarine Force Atlantic; commander, Task Force (CTF) 114, CTF 88, and CTF 46; and commander, Allied Submarine Command.

His other flag assignments include deputy chief for security cooperation, Office of the Defense Representative, Pakistan; deputy commander, Joint Functional Component Command-Global Strike; deputy commander, U.S. 6th Fleet; director of operations U.S. Naval Forces Europe-Africa; commander, Submarine Group Eight; commander, Submarine Force, U.S. Pacific Fleet; and vice director for Strategy, Plans, and Policy on the Joint Staff (J-5) in Washington, D.C.

His early sea tours included assignments as division officer, USS George Washington Carver (SSBN 656G); engineer, USS Stonewall Jackson (SSN 634B); engineer, USS Sand Lance (SSN 660); and executive officer of USS Montpelier (SSN 765).

Caudle's first command assignment was as commanding officer of USS Jefferson City (SSN 759). As deputy commander, Submarine Squadron 11, he served as commanding officer of USS Topeka (SSN 754) and USS Helena (SSN 725) due to emergent losses of the normally assigned commanding officers. He also commanded Submarine Squadron 3.

His tours ashore include assignments as assistant force nuclear power officer, Commander Submarine Force, U.S. Atlantic Fleet; officer-in-charge of Moored Training Ship (MTS 635); deputy commander of Submarine Squadron 11; assistant deputy director for information and cyberspace policy on the Joint Staff (J-5) in Washington, D.C.; and as chief of staff Commander Submarine Force, U.S. Pacific Fleet.

His personal decorations include the Navy Distinguished Service Medal, Defense Superior Service Medal (four awards), Legion of Merit (four Awards), Meritorious Service Medal (Three Awards), Navy and Marine Corps Commendation Medal (five Awards), and the Navy and Marine Corps Achievement Medal (four Awards).

He seems to have spent little time in DC. I suspect finding and vetting admirals with minimal time in DC might be why this took a while.

[Nightwatch2]

It’s not that simple, as you know. Sensors, comms equipment, guns, etc also need translation to US kit. But that’s not the problem with CONSTELLATION.

It’s that the Navy and the US designers keep playing with the design as the poor shipyards are trying to build the damn things.

Aware of that. A certain degree of sarcasm combined with disgusted frustration.

It was supposed to be something like 85% common and 15% USN unique. They have managed to flip those percentages and still going downhill.

I can see some of those changes but they might as well started from a clean sheet as far as they have screwed this up.

At the rate they’re going, we could contract with a PLA shipyard and be better off. (Sarcasm) we need a Sarcasm button….

Makes you wonder if thee 85/15 wasn't the goal all along. Didn't USN have to shoved, nearly at gunpoint, by congress to consider a foreign design? They picked one and promptly redesigned it.

The USN would never purposely go out and do that, right?

And in one of Ward Carrol’s recent videos (focused on aviation) he is discussing the Administration’s apparent postponement of the Navy FA-XX program in favor of the AF F-47.

On the same line of programs the Administration is intending to not move forward is the

Constellation Frigate

Sigh……….

Kinda saw this coming when Navsea, or whomever, “redesigned” all the basic justification out of it.

So now (snark hat on) the US Navy can’t even build a turnkey frigate after having the plans handed to them. (Snark off)

So now what?

Perhaps something similar to the old Lend Lease program where we lease someone else’s old ships in exchange for tariff relief….

[kdahm]

So now (snark hat on) the US Navy can’t even build a turnkey frigate after having the plans handed to them. (Snark off)

So now what?

Perhaps something similar to the old Lend Lease program where we lease someone else’s old ships in exchange for tariff relief….

And the shipyard owned by the original constructors of the thing, so there are much fewer management problems between the shipyards.

[Nightwatch2]

So now (snark hat on) the US Navy can’t even build a turnkey frigate after having the plans handed to them. (Snark off)

So now what?

Perhaps something similar to the old Lend Lease program where we lease someone else’s old ships in exchange for tariff relief….

And the shipyard owned by the original constructors of the thing, so there are much fewer management problems between the shipyards.

In this case it wasn’t the shipyard’s fault. It was all the changes to the design made by the Navy. The requirements were changed and the basic design still isn’t finalized.

Mark this as a complete and utter failure by the Navy

I’m reading into what’s being published that the SecNav (and CNO?) are shifting to unmanned ships. Lots of unmanned ships. That might be the explanation

[kdahm]

So now (snark hat on) the US Navy can’t even build a turnkey frigate after having the plans handed to them. (Snark off)

So now what?

Perhaps something similar to the old Lend Lease program where we lease someone else’s old ships in exchange for tariff relief….

And the shipyard owned by the original constructors of the thing, so there are much fewer management problems between the shipyards.

In this case it wasn’t the shipyard’s fault. It was all the changes to the design made by the Navy. The requirements were changed and the basic design still isn’t finalized.

Mark this as a complete and utter failure by the Navy

I’m reading into what’s being published that the SecNav (and CNO?) are shifting to unmanned ships. Lots of unmanned ships. That might be the explanation

I certainly agree. I was more pointing out that one of the other sources of problems, two different shipyards with different ideas about how to build the ships and with management that don't talk to each other, doesn't apply here.

Which makes the utter failure of any resemblance to a proper program even more of the Navy's fault.

[Pdf27]

Perhaps something similar to the old Lend Lease program where we lease someone else’s old ships in exchange for tariff relief….

I suspect the only navy who might be interested are the PLAN - for the various allied countries public acceptability of such a deal would be near-zero, while the PLA "selling" old ships to the USN would make for nice propaganda.

[Nightwatch2]

Perhaps something similar to the old Lend Lease program where we lease someone else’s old ships in exchange for tariff relief….

I suspect the only navy who might be interested are the PLAN - for the various allied countries public acceptability of such a deal would be near-zero, while the PLA "selling" old ships to the USN would make for nice propaganda.

That would be a novel way of reducing the PLA (N) ship count. The economics of it might even appeal to the First Businessman.

Actually, just to be slightly more serious for a moment, what I was more thinking of is contracting with various countries to build their latest and greatest. Which would be about the only way we could get new frigates within the needed timeframe IF the Administration does actually decide not to proceed with the Constellation program.

My contact in N98 thinks we have no choice but to proceed with the Constellation program. The Constellation is 80% complete and the new design will make it a first rate, modern frigate with a lot of new capabilities including drone ship integration. Which makes me curious as to why the Administration appears to be zeroing out the funding for it in the Navy’s budget request.

The Pentagon budget is not part of the BBB but a separate process so we’ll see The Annual Dance proceed through Congress. So far the Navy looks to be coming up short the budget wars.

Stocking up on popcorn

[Drunknsubmrnr]

It looks like the current Admin is trying to increase whatever is likely to be available in the short term vs platforms that won’t be available for a long time.

[Pdf27]

It looks like the current Admin is trying to increase whatever is likely to be available in the short term vs platforms that won’t be available for a long time.

Think they'd be interested in HMS Bristol? Combat-proven and newly available...

[Nightwatch2]

It looks like the current Admin is trying to increase whatever is likely to be available in the short term vs platforms that won’t be available for a long time.

Think they'd be interested in HMS Bristol? Combat-proven and newly available...

Probably need something more

Transformational

(Ducks)