The Cards Reshuffled
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
I can very much take on any of the callow folk from over yonder when it comes to culinary history, gastronautics and working in the consequences of different foodstuff development, have no fear.
Peanut butter, for example, can be developed quite a bit earlier than the 1890s, and in time, manufactured in such quantities as to be a useful addition of protein to quite a few diets. Developing an extract from brewer's yeast to render the nectar of the divine, Vegemite, can be done a lot earlier with the confluence of different advances. Nutella, without the palm oil, could be made earlier and popularised in due course.
Peanut butter, for example, can be developed quite a bit earlier than the 1890s, and in time, manufactured in such quantities as to be a useful addition of protein to quite a few diets. Developing an extract from brewer's yeast to render the nectar of the divine, Vegemite, can be done a lot earlier with the confluence of different advances. Nutella, without the palm oil, could be made earlier and popularised in due course.
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Here's an interesting left field idea:
Create a 'Western martial art' combined elements of krav maga, MMA, defendu and baritsu, along with stick fighting and kendo, long before the historical profile of Oriental styles, and branching off from the evolution of Western boxing. The most fitting name would of course be Ecky Thump.
Additionally, there could be some alternate developments in the development of modern fencing.
Create a 'Western martial art' combined elements of krav maga, MMA, defendu and baritsu, along with stick fighting and kendo, long before the historical profile of Oriental styles, and branching off from the evolution of Western boxing. The most fitting name would of course be Ecky Thump.
Additionally, there could be some alternate developments in the development of modern fencing.
-
- Posts: 1072
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 11:20 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
A few thoughts/ideas/suggestions....
Once you get the RN into the whole screw propeller era, get a Froude analogue to start his work 40 to 50 years early. The faster the RN can get to hydrodynamically designing its hulls in the steam era, the better it will be off with regards to budgets for the exchequer and speeds of its ships.
The cruelty to animals thing may be a difficult thing to do. The fox hunt, bear baiting, cock fighting and the like were fairly important diversions for "society" as I understand it. Slavery was one thing, as the rich and powerful were ok with divesting themselves of shares in blackbirders. Getting rid of the amusements of the rich is another thing altogether. It almost appears that you are endeavoring to enforce 20th-21st century morals on an 18th century people. I would think that would be the most difficult part of your proposed endeavor.
What is the point of this? Is it to create an AH where the British Empire is raised above the rest of the world, or are you trying to push developments as fast as possible? Or is there another reason? I know you've touched on it, but I didn't get it if you were explicit. Also, if its a plot point, then just say so, and I'll sit back and watch.
The hanging gardens reference was to Civ.... Maybe CIV 1? Wasted a lot of time back in the day playing that game!
Opening China early is possibly the other most difficult thing you're going to try to do, particularly if you're disinclined to do it with opium. You're looking at changing an entire society that is something like 7 to 10 times as large as that of Britain without a driving force. The Chinese culture at the time was about as insular as it gets. There's very little they'd be interested in importing, besides gold and silver and they were not shy about killing people who pissed them off. I suppose you could declare a war on either spurious or contrived pretexts, but its going to be rough. Also - The opium trade was well established by the POD, so you're going to also have to figure out a way to not only get the East India company to stop its own trade, with the loss of huge future profits involved, but you'll also have to stop the independent traders as well. It might almost be better to keep the closed China as a potential foe down the road.
As far as recruitment to bring the Army up to the 180 regiments, you're going to need to instill patriotism in a major way, rather than having the army being a way to get three meals a day and a bed. The Navy is a similar issue. You seem to be looking at standardizing on a particular set of larger, better armed frigates, rather than the hodgepodge the RN ended up with in @. Manning them was a tough go then, and will be tougher now, as you're going to need more men to man more and larger ships. It will take at least 15 or so years for any particular changes to start bearing fruit.
Finally..... Looks like the change is a combination of 21st century tech and magic of some sort to get the combination of time travel and increased ore bodies / resources. DO I understand correctly that its not just time travel for the 12 and their books/equipment, but also for a large chunk of the resources in question? The way you phrased it makes it seem very sinister. Did they take the unextracted resources from their time and move them back to the past? Rough for those left behind if they did.
Nice foreshadowing, by the way, about the means of time travel. Nothing spooky or suspicious there at all! *grin*
Looking forward to this.
Belushi TD
Once you get the RN into the whole screw propeller era, get a Froude analogue to start his work 40 to 50 years early. The faster the RN can get to hydrodynamically designing its hulls in the steam era, the better it will be off with regards to budgets for the exchequer and speeds of its ships.
The cruelty to animals thing may be a difficult thing to do. The fox hunt, bear baiting, cock fighting and the like were fairly important diversions for "society" as I understand it. Slavery was one thing, as the rich and powerful were ok with divesting themselves of shares in blackbirders. Getting rid of the amusements of the rich is another thing altogether. It almost appears that you are endeavoring to enforce 20th-21st century morals on an 18th century people. I would think that would be the most difficult part of your proposed endeavor.
What is the point of this? Is it to create an AH where the British Empire is raised above the rest of the world, or are you trying to push developments as fast as possible? Or is there another reason? I know you've touched on it, but I didn't get it if you were explicit. Also, if its a plot point, then just say so, and I'll sit back and watch.
The hanging gardens reference was to Civ.... Maybe CIV 1? Wasted a lot of time back in the day playing that game!
Opening China early is possibly the other most difficult thing you're going to try to do, particularly if you're disinclined to do it with opium. You're looking at changing an entire society that is something like 7 to 10 times as large as that of Britain without a driving force. The Chinese culture at the time was about as insular as it gets. There's very little they'd be interested in importing, besides gold and silver and they were not shy about killing people who pissed them off. I suppose you could declare a war on either spurious or contrived pretexts, but its going to be rough. Also - The opium trade was well established by the POD, so you're going to also have to figure out a way to not only get the East India company to stop its own trade, with the loss of huge future profits involved, but you'll also have to stop the independent traders as well. It might almost be better to keep the closed China as a potential foe down the road.
As far as recruitment to bring the Army up to the 180 regiments, you're going to need to instill patriotism in a major way, rather than having the army being a way to get three meals a day and a bed. The Navy is a similar issue. You seem to be looking at standardizing on a particular set of larger, better armed frigates, rather than the hodgepodge the RN ended up with in @. Manning them was a tough go then, and will be tougher now, as you're going to need more men to man more and larger ships. It will take at least 15 or so years for any particular changes to start bearing fruit.
Finally..... Looks like the change is a combination of 21st century tech and magic of some sort to get the combination of time travel and increased ore bodies / resources. DO I understand correctly that its not just time travel for the 12 and their books/equipment, but also for a large chunk of the resources in question? The way you phrased it makes it seem very sinister. Did they take the unextracted resources from their time and move them back to the past? Rough for those left behind if they did.
Nice foreshadowing, by the way, about the means of time travel. Nothing spooky or suspicious there at all! *grin*
Looking forward to this.
Belushi TD
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
I’ll have to respond fully after work, but for now, a small point of information: the opium trade was not ‘well established’ at this point, with the EIC only in on it from 1773, the average yearly amount being a few thousand chests, and it not yet being subject to the ban of 1796 on importation and cultivation.
With tea production from Assam, the overall need for it can be substantially reduced.
More later.
With tea production from Assam, the overall need for it can be substantially reduced.
More later.
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Alright, I have a quick half an hour before I must hit the road, so here we go:Belushi TD wrote: ↑Tue Jan 07, 2025 5:53 pm A few thoughts/ideas/suggestions....
Once you get the RN into the whole screw propeller era, get a Froude analogue to start his work 40 to 50 years early. The faster the RN can get to hydrodynamically designing its hulls in the steam era, the better it will be off with regards to budgets for the exchequer and speeds of its ships.
The cruelty to animals thing may be a difficult thing to do. The fox hunt, bear baiting, cock fighting and the like were fairly important diversions for "society" as I understand it. Slavery was one thing, as the rich and powerful were ok with divesting themselves of shares in blackbirders. Getting rid of the amusements of the rich is another thing altogether. It almost appears that you are endeavoring to enforce 20th-21st century morals on an 18th century people. I would think that would be the most difficult part of your proposed endeavor.
What is the point of this? Is it to create an AH where the British Empire is raised above the rest of the world, or are you trying to push developments as fast as possible? Or is there another reason? I know you've touched on it, but I didn't get it if you were explicit. Also, if its a plot point, then just say so, and I'll sit back and watch.
The hanging gardens reference was to Civ.... Maybe CIV 1? Wasted a lot of time back in the day playing that game!
Opening China early is possibly the other most difficult thing you're going to try to do, particularly if you're disinclined to do it with opium. You're looking at changing an entire society that is something like 7 to 10 times as large as that of Britain without a driving force. The Chinese culture at the time was about as insular as it gets. There's very little they'd be interested in importing, besides gold and silver and they were not shy about killing people who pissed them off. I suppose you could declare a war on either spurious or contrived pretexts, but its going to be rough. Also - The opium trade was well established by the POD, so you're going to also have to figure out a way to not only get the East India company to stop its own trade, with the loss of huge future profits involved, but you'll also have to stop the independent traders as well. It might almost be better to keep the closed China as a potential foe down the road.
As far as recruitment to bring the Army up to the 180 regiments, you're going to need to instill patriotism in a major way, rather than having the army being a way to get three meals a day and a bed. The Navy is a similar issue. You seem to be looking at standardizing on a particular set of larger, better armed frigates, rather than the hodgepodge the RN ended up with in @. Manning them was a tough go then, and will be tougher now, as you're going to need more men to man more and larger ships. It will take at least 15 or so years for any particular changes to start bearing fruit.
Finally..... Looks like the change is a combination of 21st century tech and magic of some sort to get the combination of time travel and increased ore bodies / resources. DO I understand correctly that its not just time travel for the 12 and their books/equipment, but also for a large chunk of the resources in question? The way you phrased it makes it seem very sinister. Did they take the unextracted resources from their time and move them back to the past? Rough for those left behind if they did.
Nice foreshadowing, by the way, about the means of time travel. Nothing spooky or suspicious there at all! *grin*
Looking forward to this.
Belushi TD
1.) A sensible measure.
2.) It isn't quite moral transfer exactly, more of an earlier rise of what took their place - boxing, cricket and football (as mentioned above, not the silly excuse that is soccer, the risible rugby or the gallivanting gridiron, but the One True Football - Aussie Rules, albeit not emerging in Australia).
Fox hunting was the stuff of the gentry and upper class, by and large, with the various baiting being more that of the working classes. Replacing them with sport happened historically by the 1830s - bear baiting had already died out due to cost, whilst a Parliamentary vote to outlaw bull baiting failed by one single vote in 1800 before it went in 1835 along with cockfighting and dogfighting.
3.) It is another reason, and one that will gradually play out in the telling...
4.) A Civ 1 reference is correct. You may choose your own cameo
5.) The Chinese were already behind in the real measures of power, and will be left even further behind by the British Empire here. China was already being prised open by traders and smugglers, and once the door was broken down, the whole rotten edifice followed. As such, I'm going to explore possible pretexts for trade and forcing in an embassy, including shows of force once the Frenchies are put in their place.
6.) It was 140 Regiments of Foot, up from the brief historical peak of 135 over 1794-1795, so it isn't a great deal of increase.
The RN will need marginally more manpower over time, but as you observe, it isn't all occurring overnight.
7.) To answer mysteriously: Yes
Thank you for the comments.
-
- Posts: 2473
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 7:25 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
With regard to Rugby Football… please to remember that the original school rules were far more akin to what we might have described, at school, as “murder rugby” than the modern game. Pleasant it was not; but it WAS appropriate for a group of 14-15yo scions of Empire to learn their bloodlust through.
Picture it as something one might expect to see in “Tomkinson’s Schooldays” (Ripping Yarns).
Picture it as something one might expect to see in “Tomkinson’s Schooldays” (Ripping Yarns).
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Well, the ball game in Tomkinson’s Schooldays was more marked by the masters being chained by the ankle beside the field and sharing a suspicious cigarette than any particular rugby of sorts.
There is more of the mugby (as described and proscribed at my own thoroughly English derived private school) you’ve characterised in the 2005 television film adaption of Tom Brown’s Schooldays, as available on YouTube from ~ 14:05-14:45 of the picture.
There will be plenty of scope for rough and tumble in the proper football that emerges here, along with a dashed site more kicking of the ball than either rugger or the American excuse.
There is more of the mugby (as described and proscribed at my own thoroughly English derived private school) you’ve characterised in the 2005 television film adaption of Tom Brown’s Schooldays, as available on YouTube from ~ 14:05-14:45 of the picture.
There will be plenty of scope for rough and tumble in the proper football that emerges here, along with a dashed site more kicking of the ball than either rugger or the American excuse.
-
- Posts: 1072
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 11:20 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
I was unaware that there was a vote to ban bull baiting in 1800. Interesting stuff.Simon Darkshade wrote: ↑Wed Jan 08, 2025 12:40 am
Alright, I have a quick half an hour before I must hit the road, so here we go:
1.) A sensible measure.
2.) It isn't quite moral transfer exactly, more of an earlier rise of what took their place - boxing, cricket and football (as mentioned above, not the silly excuse that is soccer, the risible rugby or the gallivanting gridiron, but the One True Football - Aussie Rules, albeit not emerging in Australia).
Fox hunting was the stuff of the gentry and upper class, by and large, with the various baiting being more that of the working classes. Replacing them with sport happened historically by the 1830s - bear baiting had already died out due to cost, whilst a Parliamentary vote to outlaw bull baiting failed by one single vote in 1800 before it went in 1835 along with cockfighting and dogfighting.
3.) It is another reason, and one that will gradually play out in the telling...
4.) A Civ 1 reference is correct. You may choose your own cameo
5.) The Chinese were already behind in the real measures of power, and will be left even further behind by the British Empire here. China was already being prised open by traders and smugglers, and once the door was broken down, the whole rotten edifice followed. As such, I'm going to explore possible pretexts for trade and forcing in an embassy, including shows of force once the Frenchies are put in their place.
6.) It was 140 Regiments of Foot, up from the brief historical peak of 135 over 1794-1795, so it isn't a great deal of increase.
The RN will need marginally more manpower over time, but as you observe, it isn't all occurring overnight.
7.) To answer mysteriously: Yes
Thank you for the comments.
YAY! I get to choose a cameo? Gonna have to think about this one....
Belushi TD
-
- Posts: 220
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 5:19 pm
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Are you introducing submarines any sooner?
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
They probably will make an appearance in due course, but not entirely out of naval necessity.
-
- Posts: 2473
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 7:25 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
I must admit that my dad still remarks on my being nailed to the wall, first day of my lower fifth year.Simon Darkshade wrote: ↑Wed Jan 08, 2025 9:13 am Well, the ball game in Tomkinson’s Schooldays was more marked by the masters being chained by the ankle beside the field and sharing a suspicious cigarette than any particular rugby of sorts.
There is more of the mugby (as described and proscribed at my own thoroughly English derived private school) you’ve characterised in the 2005 television film adaption of Tom Brown’s Schooldays, as available on YouTube from ~ 14:05-14:45 of the picture.
There will be plenty of scope for rough and tumble in the proper football that emerges here, along with a dashed site more kicking of the ball than either rugger or the American excuse.
I always fancied becoming Bully one day too.
https://youtu.be/HZcErcE9ai0?si=vh77KapJfGazAul3
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
The first order of priority in any ISOT is to make contact with the relevant Downtime officials or administration.
Here, the most direct means of doing so will be to approach Prime Minister William Pitt (the Younger) who for the purposes of the story will be at his Holwood residence at Keston, near Hayes in Kent. Just as in similar works, such as the Foresight War, the immediate story issue is to get the ball rolling in such a manner, by presenting with sufficient evidence to arouse curiosity and get an audience.
Once talking to Mr. Pitt, and bona fides have been established and swiftly accepted (through the agency of that rather persuasive charisma referred to in the prologue), the question is what to prioritise in the initial conversation.
My thinking is this:
- We are Britons from the future, etc, sent to give aid and the benefit of knowledge to help both win the war and then greatly increase Britain's success in the peace to follow
- The first and major issue is the war against France, how best it can be fought, and how it can be prosecuted to success much earlier and at less cost
- This will cover discussion of what happened historically; strategy; particular applicable technology (such as, but not limited to, weapons) ; the problem of particular individuals, such as Bonaparte; the means to improve British performance; and the boons of being able to pay for it
- Second from there is the major issues of policy that will confront Britain in the immediate future and the short and medium term after that
- Thirdly, there is the future development of the Empire, what places are important, and how it can be expanded strategically
- Finally, there will be the offer of assistance to improve the wealth, success and power of Britain for her domestic development. At this point, there will be the offer made to act as an advisor of sorts, who will be capable of offering the benefit of vast accumulated knowledge and presenting a range options for HMG to take, with further explanation of the utility of confidentiality and keeping knowledge of what is going on limited to a very, very few individuals
- Should that be agreeable, and for the purposes of the story, of course it will be, then it will be followed by an invitation for a representative of the Prime Minister to visit Bletchley Park, which will then allow for an explanation of what capabilities it (and its contents, which will be quite, quite 'interesting') can offer
- That will then lead into some more in depth 'briefings', which will follow naturally in Chapter 2, along with the first different decisions and actions to be taken, such as the rescue of the Dauphin
Any further ideas of what to bring up in the Pitt Meeting are most welcome.
Here, the most direct means of doing so will be to approach Prime Minister William Pitt (the Younger) who for the purposes of the story will be at his Holwood residence at Keston, near Hayes in Kent. Just as in similar works, such as the Foresight War, the immediate story issue is to get the ball rolling in such a manner, by presenting with sufficient evidence to arouse curiosity and get an audience.
Once talking to Mr. Pitt, and bona fides have been established and swiftly accepted (through the agency of that rather persuasive charisma referred to in the prologue), the question is what to prioritise in the initial conversation.
My thinking is this:
- We are Britons from the future, etc, sent to give aid and the benefit of knowledge to help both win the war and then greatly increase Britain's success in the peace to follow
- The first and major issue is the war against France, how best it can be fought, and how it can be prosecuted to success much earlier and at less cost
- This will cover discussion of what happened historically; strategy; particular applicable technology (such as, but not limited to, weapons) ; the problem of particular individuals, such as Bonaparte; the means to improve British performance; and the boons of being able to pay for it
- Second from there is the major issues of policy that will confront Britain in the immediate future and the short and medium term after that
- Thirdly, there is the future development of the Empire, what places are important, and how it can be expanded strategically
- Finally, there will be the offer of assistance to improve the wealth, success and power of Britain for her domestic development. At this point, there will be the offer made to act as an advisor of sorts, who will be capable of offering the benefit of vast accumulated knowledge and presenting a range options for HMG to take, with further explanation of the utility of confidentiality and keeping knowledge of what is going on limited to a very, very few individuals
- Should that be agreeable, and for the purposes of the story, of course it will be, then it will be followed by an invitation for a representative of the Prime Minister to visit Bletchley Park, which will then allow for an explanation of what capabilities it (and its contents, which will be quite, quite 'interesting') can offer
- That will then lead into some more in depth 'briefings', which will follow naturally in Chapter 2, along with the first different decisions and actions to be taken, such as the rescue of the Dauphin
Any further ideas of what to bring up in the Pitt Meeting are most welcome.
-
- Posts: 1072
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 11:20 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Didn't Pitt the Younger basically get the boot because of the Act of Union in 1800? Maybe see if you can convince him its a step too far at this point. Maybe reducing the scale of the act of union will keep him in office and not see the Peace of Aimes allow France and Spain a respite. Of course, if you can keep the events of 1798 from happening, might not need the act of union in the first place.
However convincing the parties in question to work together and not revolt is a different question.
Belushi TD
However convincing the parties in question to work together and not revolt is a different question.
Belushi TD
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
No.
He didn’t get the boot at all, but resigned due to the failure to get the King to agree to Catholic emancipation. His resignation was then followed by a bout of the King’s illness/madness. As such, it isn’t quite the situation as characterised.
Timing the Act of Union will be important, but it isn’t the paramount issue as of January 1794. The first priority is to give France a darn good thrashing, such that there won’t be any scope or need for a peace until victory. Spain isn’t yet an enemy, but once it is, it has some possessions that are attractive gains.
Pitt would likely be interested in measures that could head 1798 off at the pass, so to speak, which would combine bagging some of the potential leadership and ameliorating some of the immediate triggering factors. Being in a position where there is no scope for French intervention would not hurt.
His position regarding the debt and cost of the war will be interesting, particularly when he is told what is available.
He didn’t get the boot at all, but resigned due to the failure to get the King to agree to Catholic emancipation. His resignation was then followed by a bout of the King’s illness/madness. As such, it isn’t quite the situation as characterised.
Timing the Act of Union will be important, but it isn’t the paramount issue as of January 1794. The first priority is to give France a darn good thrashing, such that there won’t be any scope or need for a peace until victory. Spain isn’t yet an enemy, but once it is, it has some possessions that are attractive gains.
Pitt would likely be interested in measures that could head 1798 off at the pass, so to speak, which would combine bagging some of the potential leadership and ameliorating some of the immediate triggering factors. Being in a position where there is no scope for French intervention would not hurt.
His position regarding the debt and cost of the war will be interesting, particularly when he is told what is available.
-
- Posts: 1450
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2022 10:56 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Apologies.
Have been trying to follow this, but mild relapse of vision problems precludes.
Another retinal-bleed clearing injection due later today///
Ick.
Still, from what I've read of TCR, enthralling stuff !!
( My 'Mongoose' was already 'mostly written', only required recursive tidying plus a few tweaks before posting.
Reading is a different matter, I have a growing stack of 'pendings'...)
Have been trying to follow this, but mild relapse of vision problems precludes.
Another retinal-bleed clearing injection due later today///
Ick.
Still, from what I've read of TCR, enthralling stuff !!
( My 'Mongoose' was already 'mostly written', only required recursive tidying plus a few tweaks before posting.
Reading is a different matter, I have a growing stack of 'pendings'...)
- jemhouston
- Posts: 4526
- Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2022 12:38 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
Nik, kick back and relax for a few days. Your body is telling you something, so listen to it.Nik_SpeakerToCats wrote: ↑Thu Jan 09, 2025 6:11 pm Apologies.
Have been trying to follow this, but mild relapse of vision problems precludes.
Another retinal-bleed clearing injection due later today///
Ick.
Still, from what I've read of TCR, enthralling stuff !!
( My 'Mongoose' was already 'mostly written', only required recursive tidying plus a few tweaks before posting.
Reading is a different matter, I have a growing stack of 'pendings'...)
-
- Posts: 2473
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 7:25 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
What Jem said. Look, listen & pay heed Nik!
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
As the others have said, let the peepers have a rest, Nik. The writing of this, and the other stuff, is constrained by a six day a week manual shift job, so won't proceed at a rapid pace initially, as I do need to sleep occasionally.
-
- Posts: 1244
- Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 10:55 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
The Cards Reshuffled 1
Browning drew his coat closer about him as they drove through the blackness of the night down the empty (and from his perspective uneven and bumpy) road at the tremendous pace of twenty five miles an hour. Tremendous for this new era, perhaps, but not for the 2069 Land Rover, as he preferred to think of the vehicle, despite its rather different nomenclature in the benighted epoch from whence it came. The electrical motor was thankfully quiet, allowing him to become lost in the reverie of his thoughts.
The first act would be the most uncertain, even as he was confident that the various preparations and …capabilities… would act to iron out some of the difficulties inherent in the ‘first contact’ ahead. He was bound to call upon the First Lord of the Treasury, William Pitt, at his country house, where their pre-journey research back in the ‘other land’ had indicated he would be; this was something of a stroke of good fortune, as the alternate of presenting at 10 Downing Street would have been a bit more of a security challenge in terms of not being overt in the first approach.
There would doubtless be all manner of potential complications involved with utilising the car for this leg of the journey to Keston, but the late hour and conveniently foul weather was hopefully bound to keep the majority of other travellers safely away indoors and the active camouflage cloak would do for the rest. When it came to what happened upon his arrival, or actual nature of his discussion with Pitt, he was reasonably confident that the proofs he carried would at least elicit some degree of interest, and that what he had in his pocketses would get around any natural skepticism as best as possible.
Some of the others were already starting their initial moves, with Blakeney bound for France; the two nautical types for Portsmouth and the Royal Navy, replete with carefully constructed letters of introduction; and Blackadder for London. Further steps would be made carefully, with reference to the support to be garnered here. The Twelve were not alone in the house, with the staff of Bletchley Park and the surrounding estate being dual-hatted in their supporting role, but there had been further measures taken to ensure their compliance with the Plan.
After what seemed a cliche, the car drew to a halt.
"According to our maps, this is it, sir. A copse half a mile away from Mr. Pitt's residence." Browning's burly driver, Watson, spoke with a practiced Buckinghamshire burr.
"Excellent, Watson. If we switch to the natural scheme, then we can lay up until the appropriate time."
...........
And that time eventually came, and saw Mr. Simon Browning, Esquire, walking down the avenue leading to Holwood Park. Had there been more time, and his errand not quite so vital, then there may have been scope for seeing the Wilberforce Oak and drinking in a bit of that history; making history was the far greater task, for now.
He rang upon the door and waited.
"Yes, sir?" snooted the footman, snootily.
"I am here to see Mr. Pitt."
"Do you have an appointment, sir?"
"I do not. I am come on a mission of no small urgency related to the war on the Continent, bearing materials and intelligence of great import and great secrecy. If you would present my card, this envelope and this book to the Prime Minister, I am sure that he will received me."
"Very good, sir. If you would come through into the parlour, I shall inquire as to Mr. Pitt's intentions."
The immediate suspicion and hostility of the footman seemed to be slightly thawing, which he had expected. There likely had been a number of such visitors, both here and in London, what with the goings on at Toulon and in the Vendée, and another such come on New Year's morning was not entirely beyond the pale of the expected.
So it was that Browning sat and waited, fingering the ring in his right pocket with some degree of nerves, until the door opened and the somewhat surprised footman gestured for him to follow.
Mr. Pitt stood in his drawing room, easily six foot tall and pale, possessed of a high forehead as yet unlined with future cares, and clad in the same type of black and white ensemble appropriate to a man of his class and station.
"Mr. Browning, I presume, of Bletchley Park." Pitt turned over the curious card in his hands
"Indeed, sir." Browning bowed his head respectfully.
"Well, Mr. Browning, if that be your name, you have my curiosity. This," he held up the bundle of papers from within the envelope "could well be some sort of clever forgery, however well printed and...remarkably well informed... it seems to be on certain areas. But this book...this seems a little more complicated. History of the Wars of the French Revolution by a Mr. Edward Baines, purporting to be a history 'From the Breaking Out of the War in 1792, to the Restoration of a General Peace, in 1815. Comprehending the Civil History of Great Britain and France During That Period.' A book published, Mr. Browning, in 1817. Some twenty-three years from now."
"So it was, Prime Minister. It was rather difficult to get such an old book where I am come from, but not impossible. Very little, it seems, is truly impossible. Even if it be a two hundred and sixty year old history."
"Two hundred and sixty?! That means..."
"Yes, Prime Minister. I acquired the book in your hand in the Year of Our Lord 2077. The future."
Pitt looked at the stranger - and he had not heard a stranger tale in all his years - and appraised the man again. He was young, not uncomely, with flaxen hair of medium length and deep azure eyes that sparkled with intelligence. Without knowing exactly how or why, he felt somehow drawn to the fellow, as if he could trust him somehow.
"Let us suppose, for a moment, Mr. Browning, that you are in fact from ...another time and place...What then is your purpose?"
"Sir, the time from which I, and my fellows, have come, was one of war, one of horror, and one of defeat. Mankind had almost destroyed itself; even as he was capable of the most unbelievable of wonders, he also wrought the most terrible of atrocities. The promise of all that had been, of decency and liberty, of freedom and justice, of Christian civilisation itself - all of it had fallen, fallen in ruin and leaving the world teetering on the edge of the abyss of a new Dark Age, if Man himself can survive. England has been defeated and conquered by her foes."
"Who were these enemies?"
"A terrible and quite alien force that controlled the Old World and mustered all the strength and armies of Europe, Russia and China against us. They were opposed valiantly, but could not be held." said Browning, smoothly. "All that was left was used on a last desperate mission, a final experiment, as it were, to change time, change the past and change the future, so that mankind's downfall can be averted and changed."
"If you were able to, as you say, voyage through time as if it were a sea, why come here and now? What is it about Britain in 1794 that caused you to come?" Pitt felt as if his head was in something of a fog, similar to but yet profoundly unlike the pleasant stupor aroused by his bottles of porter.
"Put simply, sir, it is this current war and its consequences. It stands athwart time as something of a fulcrum, shifting the progress and destiny of mankind in so many ways. Should different actions and choices here alter the outcome of great events, then the nature of the world itself will change in the decades and centuries to come, profoundly. Consider, Prime Minister, if you will, what might have occurred if Harold had won at Hastings and William had died, or if the Turks at Constantinople had been set aside."
"I see. Or rather, I am beginning to see. Please, do be seated, Mr. Browning."
"Thank you, Prime Minister."
"So you are here to bring us a warning?"
"Aye, sir, that we are, but more besides. The nature of my coming, or our coming, to be more precise, was such that we came with the house that we occupied at the time. A house filled with thousands upon thousands of books, just like that one, and even better and more useful, I'll warrant, and with tools, and papers, and medicines and weapons, and above all with knowledge, with the fruits of literally centuries of advances. It is with this knowledge, and the modest skills that I and my eleven fellows possess across various areas of expertise, that we would seek to give such aid and succour that Britannia may emerge triumphant over the bloodthirsty revolutionaries across the Channel, and to achieve such a victory at far less cost in blood and treasure compared to the outcome written of by Mr. Baines."
"A most heartening prospect, Mr. Browning."
"Thank you, sir. If I may be so bold as to proffer a suggestion..."
"You may."
"The years that lie ahead will present particular challenges and weighty events. In this year, for example, many of the Jacobin monsters will fall prey to the infernal and perverse engine of their own orgy of bloodshed, the guillotine, whilst the Royal Navy will win a great victory over the French in June that, with some assistance, might well be greater and more glorious yet. At the same time as these kernels of hope are kindled, there are mistakes and problems that might be avoided. The occupation of Saint-Domingue becomes a running sore which sees millions of pounds wasted to no end and thousands of lives of British soldiers snuffed out by the cruel tropical terror of yellow fever. We have the means to provide sufficient advice to add to the roll of victories and shorten the list of defeats and disasters."
As of this year, there are perhaps three major ...'situations'... that confront England, for want of a better word. The first is one of which you will be aware - Ireland. With no change in action and policy, there will be a revolt in 1798 that will of course be successfully put down, but in doing so, it is likely the seeds of future strife will be sown. The second is to do with France, where the greatest thread lies not in the person of Robespierre, but in an as-yet obscure commander of Corsican extraction, one Napoleon Bonaparte. If he is not stopped, in some fashion, it is likely that he will will take advantage of the chaos and strife of France to rise to power and terrorise all of Europe for 20 years until finally defeated. In the third and final instance, the French will effectively conquer the Netherlands and suborn Spain into switching sides in the war."
"That gives me much to grapple with. Does this book of Mr. Baines' contain further detail on this?"
"Of course, sir. There is enough in there to support a great deal of what we've discussed this morning, but we have so very much more that can be offered. This is all indeed a tremendous tale, and one where naturally you or any other great man would naturally be, as the French might put it 'sceptic'. I propose to offer you proof, or more proof than Mr. Baines' book and this short account of your own life and times. Upon my arrival, I have made my residence at a house called Bletchley Park, in Buckinghamshire. Once you return to London, you can send a trusted friend and ally, such as Thomas Steele, up to visit the house. Therein, I can show him what we are able to do, and, if I might conjure an image, 'get the ball rolling'."
"That would seem to be acceptable. You say you can offer this knowledge for our benefit?"
"Yes, Prime Minister, and for our benefit as well. We are Englishmen, after all, even if we come from a different time, and wish for Britain to win the war and the peace that will follow. As well as knowledge, we can offer advice as to the best strategy to defeat France once and for all; advice as the to the major policies and issues that Britain will face in the immediate future and in the short and medium term future after that point; advice on the further development and prosperity of the Empire and how it can be expanded and developed; and finally, we can offer advice to improve the wealth, success and power of Britain here on her own shores. Even after the war has been concluded, should it be agreeable, then we would like to offer the services of myself or another one of our fellows to act as a general advisor and counsellor of sorts, able to offer the benefit of vast accumulated knowledge to His Majesty's Government, on a confidential basis of course. With what we have to offer, and there is more than mere knowledge at Bletchley Park, Prime Minister, future history and the success of Britain can be radically changed and changed for the better."
"Everything can be changed? The ill, I mean, and this?" Pitt pointed to the last page of the papers, a printed biography of William Pitt, the Younger, and seemingly to the paragraph headed 'Death'.
"We are not gods, sir, just mere men. We cannot put a stop to mortality, nor ensure that death shall have no dominion, but yes, we can absolutely extend the span of any man's days, within reason, and offer a cure to much that in this day may not be understood."
"Not Death, Mr. Browning. This." His finger hovered over the heading 'Legacy'.
"That we can indeed change, Prime Minister."
"Then you shall return to your Bletchley Park, Mr. Browning, and I shall have Mr. Steele come to call upon you and your fellows. If what you have said is but a clever subterfuge, then I must caution you that it will not go well for you. If what you say is true, or even part of it, then Britain will be greater yet. Good day, Mr. Browning."
Mr. William Pitt, the Younger, sat down to read through the book and the papers. There was much to be done.
Browning drew his coat closer about him as they drove through the blackness of the night down the empty (and from his perspective uneven and bumpy) road at the tremendous pace of twenty five miles an hour. Tremendous for this new era, perhaps, but not for the 2069 Land Rover, as he preferred to think of the vehicle, despite its rather different nomenclature in the benighted epoch from whence it came. The electrical motor was thankfully quiet, allowing him to become lost in the reverie of his thoughts.
The first act would be the most uncertain, even as he was confident that the various preparations and …capabilities… would act to iron out some of the difficulties inherent in the ‘first contact’ ahead. He was bound to call upon the First Lord of the Treasury, William Pitt, at his country house, where their pre-journey research back in the ‘other land’ had indicated he would be; this was something of a stroke of good fortune, as the alternate of presenting at 10 Downing Street would have been a bit more of a security challenge in terms of not being overt in the first approach.
There would doubtless be all manner of potential complications involved with utilising the car for this leg of the journey to Keston, but the late hour and conveniently foul weather was hopefully bound to keep the majority of other travellers safely away indoors and the active camouflage cloak would do for the rest. When it came to what happened upon his arrival, or actual nature of his discussion with Pitt, he was reasonably confident that the proofs he carried would at least elicit some degree of interest, and that what he had in his pocketses would get around any natural skepticism as best as possible.
Some of the others were already starting their initial moves, with Blakeney bound for France; the two nautical types for Portsmouth and the Royal Navy, replete with carefully constructed letters of introduction; and Blackadder for London. Further steps would be made carefully, with reference to the support to be garnered here. The Twelve were not alone in the house, with the staff of Bletchley Park and the surrounding estate being dual-hatted in their supporting role, but there had been further measures taken to ensure their compliance with the Plan.
After what seemed a cliche, the car drew to a halt.
"According to our maps, this is it, sir. A copse half a mile away from Mr. Pitt's residence." Browning's burly driver, Watson, spoke with a practiced Buckinghamshire burr.
"Excellent, Watson. If we switch to the natural scheme, then we can lay up until the appropriate time."
...........
And that time eventually came, and saw Mr. Simon Browning, Esquire, walking down the avenue leading to Holwood Park. Had there been more time, and his errand not quite so vital, then there may have been scope for seeing the Wilberforce Oak and drinking in a bit of that history; making history was the far greater task, for now.
He rang upon the door and waited.
"Yes, sir?" snooted the footman, snootily.
"I am here to see Mr. Pitt."
"Do you have an appointment, sir?"
"I do not. I am come on a mission of no small urgency related to the war on the Continent, bearing materials and intelligence of great import and great secrecy. If you would present my card, this envelope and this book to the Prime Minister, I am sure that he will received me."
"Very good, sir. If you would come through into the parlour, I shall inquire as to Mr. Pitt's intentions."
The immediate suspicion and hostility of the footman seemed to be slightly thawing, which he had expected. There likely had been a number of such visitors, both here and in London, what with the goings on at Toulon and in the Vendée, and another such come on New Year's morning was not entirely beyond the pale of the expected.
So it was that Browning sat and waited, fingering the ring in his right pocket with some degree of nerves, until the door opened and the somewhat surprised footman gestured for him to follow.
Mr. Pitt stood in his drawing room, easily six foot tall and pale, possessed of a high forehead as yet unlined with future cares, and clad in the same type of black and white ensemble appropriate to a man of his class and station.
"Mr. Browning, I presume, of Bletchley Park." Pitt turned over the curious card in his hands
"Indeed, sir." Browning bowed his head respectfully.
"Well, Mr. Browning, if that be your name, you have my curiosity. This," he held up the bundle of papers from within the envelope "could well be some sort of clever forgery, however well printed and...remarkably well informed... it seems to be on certain areas. But this book...this seems a little more complicated. History of the Wars of the French Revolution by a Mr. Edward Baines, purporting to be a history 'From the Breaking Out of the War in 1792, to the Restoration of a General Peace, in 1815. Comprehending the Civil History of Great Britain and France During That Period.' A book published, Mr. Browning, in 1817. Some twenty-three years from now."
"So it was, Prime Minister. It was rather difficult to get such an old book where I am come from, but not impossible. Very little, it seems, is truly impossible. Even if it be a two hundred and sixty year old history."
"Two hundred and sixty?! That means..."
"Yes, Prime Minister. I acquired the book in your hand in the Year of Our Lord 2077. The future."
Pitt looked at the stranger - and he had not heard a stranger tale in all his years - and appraised the man again. He was young, not uncomely, with flaxen hair of medium length and deep azure eyes that sparkled with intelligence. Without knowing exactly how or why, he felt somehow drawn to the fellow, as if he could trust him somehow.
"Let us suppose, for a moment, Mr. Browning, that you are in fact from ...another time and place...What then is your purpose?"
"Sir, the time from which I, and my fellows, have come, was one of war, one of horror, and one of defeat. Mankind had almost destroyed itself; even as he was capable of the most unbelievable of wonders, he also wrought the most terrible of atrocities. The promise of all that had been, of decency and liberty, of freedom and justice, of Christian civilisation itself - all of it had fallen, fallen in ruin and leaving the world teetering on the edge of the abyss of a new Dark Age, if Man himself can survive. England has been defeated and conquered by her foes."
"Who were these enemies?"
"A terrible and quite alien force that controlled the Old World and mustered all the strength and armies of Europe, Russia and China against us. They were opposed valiantly, but could not be held." said Browning, smoothly. "All that was left was used on a last desperate mission, a final experiment, as it were, to change time, change the past and change the future, so that mankind's downfall can be averted and changed."
"If you were able to, as you say, voyage through time as if it were a sea, why come here and now? What is it about Britain in 1794 that caused you to come?" Pitt felt as if his head was in something of a fog, similar to but yet profoundly unlike the pleasant stupor aroused by his bottles of porter.
"Put simply, sir, it is this current war and its consequences. It stands athwart time as something of a fulcrum, shifting the progress and destiny of mankind in so many ways. Should different actions and choices here alter the outcome of great events, then the nature of the world itself will change in the decades and centuries to come, profoundly. Consider, Prime Minister, if you will, what might have occurred if Harold had won at Hastings and William had died, or if the Turks at Constantinople had been set aside."
"I see. Or rather, I am beginning to see. Please, do be seated, Mr. Browning."
"Thank you, Prime Minister."
"So you are here to bring us a warning?"
"Aye, sir, that we are, but more besides. The nature of my coming, or our coming, to be more precise, was such that we came with the house that we occupied at the time. A house filled with thousands upon thousands of books, just like that one, and even better and more useful, I'll warrant, and with tools, and papers, and medicines and weapons, and above all with knowledge, with the fruits of literally centuries of advances. It is with this knowledge, and the modest skills that I and my eleven fellows possess across various areas of expertise, that we would seek to give such aid and succour that Britannia may emerge triumphant over the bloodthirsty revolutionaries across the Channel, and to achieve such a victory at far less cost in blood and treasure compared to the outcome written of by Mr. Baines."
"A most heartening prospect, Mr. Browning."
"Thank you, sir. If I may be so bold as to proffer a suggestion..."
"You may."
"The years that lie ahead will present particular challenges and weighty events. In this year, for example, many of the Jacobin monsters will fall prey to the infernal and perverse engine of their own orgy of bloodshed, the guillotine, whilst the Royal Navy will win a great victory over the French in June that, with some assistance, might well be greater and more glorious yet. At the same time as these kernels of hope are kindled, there are mistakes and problems that might be avoided. The occupation of Saint-Domingue becomes a running sore which sees millions of pounds wasted to no end and thousands of lives of British soldiers snuffed out by the cruel tropical terror of yellow fever. We have the means to provide sufficient advice to add to the roll of victories and shorten the list of defeats and disasters."
As of this year, there are perhaps three major ...'situations'... that confront England, for want of a better word. The first is one of which you will be aware - Ireland. With no change in action and policy, there will be a revolt in 1798 that will of course be successfully put down, but in doing so, it is likely the seeds of future strife will be sown. The second is to do with France, where the greatest thread lies not in the person of Robespierre, but in an as-yet obscure commander of Corsican extraction, one Napoleon Bonaparte. If he is not stopped, in some fashion, it is likely that he will will take advantage of the chaos and strife of France to rise to power and terrorise all of Europe for 20 years until finally defeated. In the third and final instance, the French will effectively conquer the Netherlands and suborn Spain into switching sides in the war."
"That gives me much to grapple with. Does this book of Mr. Baines' contain further detail on this?"
"Of course, sir. There is enough in there to support a great deal of what we've discussed this morning, but we have so very much more that can be offered. This is all indeed a tremendous tale, and one where naturally you or any other great man would naturally be, as the French might put it 'sceptic'. I propose to offer you proof, or more proof than Mr. Baines' book and this short account of your own life and times. Upon my arrival, I have made my residence at a house called Bletchley Park, in Buckinghamshire. Once you return to London, you can send a trusted friend and ally, such as Thomas Steele, up to visit the house. Therein, I can show him what we are able to do, and, if I might conjure an image, 'get the ball rolling'."
"That would seem to be acceptable. You say you can offer this knowledge for our benefit?"
"Yes, Prime Minister, and for our benefit as well. We are Englishmen, after all, even if we come from a different time, and wish for Britain to win the war and the peace that will follow. As well as knowledge, we can offer advice as to the best strategy to defeat France once and for all; advice as the to the major policies and issues that Britain will face in the immediate future and in the short and medium term future after that point; advice on the further development and prosperity of the Empire and how it can be expanded and developed; and finally, we can offer advice to improve the wealth, success and power of Britain here on her own shores. Even after the war has been concluded, should it be agreeable, then we would like to offer the services of myself or another one of our fellows to act as a general advisor and counsellor of sorts, able to offer the benefit of vast accumulated knowledge to His Majesty's Government, on a confidential basis of course. With what we have to offer, and there is more than mere knowledge at Bletchley Park, Prime Minister, future history and the success of Britain can be radically changed and changed for the better."
"Everything can be changed? The ill, I mean, and this?" Pitt pointed to the last page of the papers, a printed biography of William Pitt, the Younger, and seemingly to the paragraph headed 'Death'.
"We are not gods, sir, just mere men. We cannot put a stop to mortality, nor ensure that death shall have no dominion, but yes, we can absolutely extend the span of any man's days, within reason, and offer a cure to much that in this day may not be understood."
"Not Death, Mr. Browning. This." His finger hovered over the heading 'Legacy'.
"That we can indeed change, Prime Minister."
"Then you shall return to your Bletchley Park, Mr. Browning, and I shall have Mr. Steele come to call upon you and your fellows. If what you have said is but a clever subterfuge, then I must caution you that it will not go well for you. If what you say is true, or even part of it, then Britain will be greater yet. Good day, Mr. Browning."
Mr. William Pitt, the Younger, sat down to read through the book and the papers. There was much to be done.
- jemhouston
- Posts: 4526
- Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2022 12:38 am
Re: The Cards Reshuffled
The longest journey starts with a single step.
Simon how are you feeling?
Simon how are you feeling?